MSI Center laptop battery setting question


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If I set MSI Center to make the laptop only charge until 60% but sometimes it charges until 58%/59% or 61%/62% and even after removing the partition where MSI Center is installed the laptop still charges until 60% (or close). How is this possible?
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 11
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    MSI Katana 15 B12VGK
    CPU
    Intel Core i7-12650H
    Memory
    16 GB (2x8 GB) DDR5-4800MHz SO-DIMM
    Graphics Card(s)
    Intel UHD Graphics + NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4070 Laptop GPU 8 GB GDDR6
    Monitor(s) Displays
    15.6" Full HD (1920x1080) 144Hz Refresh Rate 16:9 IPS Display
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080p
    Hard Drives
    SSD 1 TB NVMe PCIe Gen 4x4
    PSU
    240 W Power Supply
    Case
    Core Black
    Cooling
    Cooler Boost 5
    Keyboard
    Backlit keyboard with numeric keypad and PT-PT layout
    Internet Speed
    500 Mbps
    Browser
    Google Chrome
MSI Centre is probably just a UI for changes that are written in the Bios.
Take a look at the Bios and you'll probably find those settings there.

Denis
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 11 Home x64 Version 23H2 Build 22631.3447
MSI Centre is probably just a UI for changes that are written in the Bios.
Take a look at the Bios and you'll probably find those settings there.

Denis

I already did but I couldn't find it. Also, when installing MSI Center, it asks to restart Windows, and when the PC is turning off, Windows states it's installing updates. I thought only updates installed by Windows Update made this message to show up. Moreover, after Windows turns on and supposedly finishes installing updates, if I restart the PC, Windows states it's installing updates again but it forever hangs so I'm forced to press the PC's power button until it turns off (may this damage the PC?). After turning it on, Windows doesn't state it's installing updates, I'm able to run MSI Center and after restarting the PC, Windows doesn't state it's installing updates. Isn't all of this weird?
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 11
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    MSI Katana 15 B12VGK
    CPU
    Intel Core i7-12650H
    Memory
    16 GB (2x8 GB) DDR5-4800MHz SO-DIMM
    Graphics Card(s)
    Intel UHD Graphics + NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4070 Laptop GPU 8 GB GDDR6
    Monitor(s) Displays
    15.6" Full HD (1920x1080) 144Hz Refresh Rate 16:9 IPS Display
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080p
    Hard Drives
    SSD 1 TB NVMe PCIe Gen 4x4
    PSU
    240 W Power Supply
    Case
    Core Black
    Cooling
    Cooler Boost 5
    Keyboard
    Backlit keyboard with numeric keypad and PT-PT layout
    Internet Speed
    500 Mbps
    Browser
    Google Chrome
I suggest that you address those update issues before worrying about charging levels. A new thread would seem best for that.

That MSI Centre might be explained in their support pages but you will find that it is controlling Bios settings whether or not MSI allows you to see those in the Bios.
Nobody has ever published data that proves that limiting charging does any good for lithium ion batteries anyway.


All the best,
Denis
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 11 Home x64 Version 23H2 Build 22631.3447
I suggest that you address those update issues before worrying about charging levels. A new thread would seem best for that.

That MSI Centre might be explained in their support pages but you will find that it is controlling Bios settings whether or not MSI allows you to see those in the Bios.
Nobody has ever published data that proves that limiting charging does any good for lithium ion batteries anyway.


All the best,
Denis

I already addressed the update issues.

Since this setting exists I thought it would do good for them.
 
Last edited:

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 11
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    MSI Katana 15 B12VGK
    CPU
    Intel Core i7-12650H
    Memory
    16 GB (2x8 GB) DDR5-4800MHz SO-DIMM
    Graphics Card(s)
    Intel UHD Graphics + NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4070 Laptop GPU 8 GB GDDR6
    Monitor(s) Displays
    15.6" Full HD (1920x1080) 144Hz Refresh Rate 16:9 IPS Display
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080p
    Hard Drives
    SSD 1 TB NVMe PCIe Gen 4x4
    PSU
    240 W Power Supply
    Case
    Core Black
    Cooling
    Cooler Boost 5
    Keyboard
    Backlit keyboard with numeric keypad and PT-PT layout
    Internet Speed
    500 Mbps
    Browser
    Google Chrome
MSI Centre is exactly what it says. A central point to access certain settings be they BIOS/UEFI, Windows settings, System settings, manufacturer specific Laptop settings, Fn key settings, support etc.

The Charge to 60% is probably actually a UEFI or system setting, it is just more convenient to use the MSI Centre.

It may not be seen in the UEFI settings pages.

So removing the MSI Centre does nothing, it is just a frontend for that UEFI/system setting.

Mine is a different brand and the charge to 80% does not appear in the UEFI settings, only in the Manufacturers App.

Windows updates is not related to this.
You are messing around interrupting updates, just let them go and finish which includes quite a time after the last Restart.

You wait until this is all done before installing the MSI Centre.

"Isn't all of this weird?"
Not at all, this is standard stuff. You are just making for difficulties.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 11
MSI Centre is exactly what it says. A central point to access certain settings be they BIOS/UEFI, Windows settings, System settings, manufacturer specific Laptop settings, Fn key settings, support etc.

The Charge to 60% is probably actually a UEFI or system setting, it is just more convenient to use the MSI Centre.

It may not be seen in the UEFI settings pages.

So removing the MSI Centre does nothing, it is just a frontend for that UEFI/system setting.

Mine is a different brand and the charge to 80% does not appear in the UEFI settings, only in the Manufacturers App.

Windows updates is not related to this.
You are messing around interrupting updates, just let them go and finish which includes quite a time after the last Restart.

You wait until this is all done before installing the MSI Centre.

"Isn't all of this weird?"
Not at all, this is standard stuff. You are just making for difficulties.

But I let the PC install the updates and it hangs fotever. I let it stay like that more than 20 hours and thrice.
 
Last edited:

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 11
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    MSI Katana 15 B12VGK
    CPU
    Intel Core i7-12650H
    Memory
    16 GB (2x8 GB) DDR5-4800MHz SO-DIMM
    Graphics Card(s)
    Intel UHD Graphics + NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4070 Laptop GPU 8 GB GDDR6
    Monitor(s) Displays
    15.6" Full HD (1920x1080) 144Hz Refresh Rate 16:9 IPS Display
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080p
    Hard Drives
    SSD 1 TB NVMe PCIe Gen 4x4
    PSU
    240 W Power Supply
    Case
    Core Black
    Cooling
    Cooler Boost 5
    Keyboard
    Backlit keyboard with numeric keypad and PT-PT layout
    Internet Speed
    500 Mbps
    Browser
    Google Chrome
When I suggested you "address" the update issues, what I meant was that I think you should let the current thread just sit here doing nothing while you focus your efforts on solving the update issues.


Best of luck,
Denis
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 11 Home x64 Version 23H2 Build 22631.3447
Nobody has ever published data that proves that limiting charging does any good for lithium ion batteries anyway.
I'm going to very strongly debate that. It is 100% proven fact that limiting the charge on LiIon batteries can increase their lifespan dramatically.

The issue here is that this helps if you leave the LiIon battery fully charged for extended periods of time. Simply charging to 100% is not the issue. Rather, if your typical usage scenario is that you use the laptop (or other equipment) plugged in and allow it to sit with the battery fully charged for extended periods of time, this will 100% absolutely, guaranteed, result in a shorter lifespan than if you charged it to a lower level.

Don't misunderstand me - it's not like this will rapidly kill your battery. But it absolutely will make a difference. Many manufacturers see no need for addressing this because the battery is typically an easily replaceable part. However, in modern equipment that is sealed and not made for easy consumer replacement of the battery, hav9ng the ability to lengthen the lifespan of the battery makes sense.

This is not even up for debate. This is basic LiIon knowledge 101 for those of us with engineering and design backgrounds in LiIon battery charge management.

A cursory search in your favorite browser will yield much info on this topic.

EDIT: For a very simplistic discussion, see this article, especially the "Depth of Charge" section:


A more in depth discussion can be found here:

 

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Win11 Pro 24H2
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Self-built
    CPU
    Intel i7 11700K
    Motherboard
    ASUS Prime Z590-A MB
    Memory
    64GB (Waiting for warranty replacement of another 64GB for 128GB total)
    Graphics Card(s)
    No GPU - Built-in Intel Graphics
    Sound Card
    Integrated
    Monitor(s) Displays
    HP Envy 32
    Screen Resolution
    2560 x 1440
    Hard Drives
    1 x 1TB NVMe SSD
    1 x 2TB NVMe SSD
    1 x 4TB NVMe SSD
    3 x 512GB 2.5" SSD
    1 x 4TB 2.5" SSD
    5 x 8TB Seagate Barracuda HDD
    PSU
    Corsair HX850i
    Case
    Corsair iCUE RGB 5000X mid tower case
    Cooling
    Noctua NF-S12A chromax.black.swap case fans (Qty. 7) & Home Computer Specifications, Configuration, and Usage Notes General Specifications ASUS Prime Z590-A motherboard, serial number M1M0KC222467ARP Intel Core i7-11700K CPU (11th Gen Rocket Lake / LGA 1200 Socket) 128GB Crucial Ballistix RGB DDR4 3200 MHz DRAM (4 x 32GB) Corsair iCUE RGB 5000X mid tower case Noctua NH-D15 chromax.black CPU cooler Noctua NF-S12A chromax.black.swap case fans (Qty. 7) & Corsair LL-120 RGB Fans (Qty. 3)
    Keyboard
    Corsair K70 Max RGB Magnetic Keyboard
    Mouse
    Logitech MX Master 3
    Internet Speed
    1Gb Up / 1 Gb Down
    Browser
    Edge
    Antivirus
    Windows Defender
    Other Info
    The five 8TB drives and three 512GB SSDs are part of a DrivePool using StableBit DrivePool software. The three SSDs are devoted purely to caching for the 8TB drives. All of the important data is stored in triplicate so that I can withstand simultaneous failure of 2 disks.

    Networking: 2.5Gbps Ethernet and WiFi 6e
  • Operating System
    Win11 Pro 23H2
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Lenovo ThinkBook 13x Gen 2
    CPU
    Intel i7-1255U
    Memory
    16 GB
    Graphics card(s)
    Intel Iris Xe Graphics
    Sound Card
    Realtek® ALC3306-CG codec
    Monitor(s) Displays
    13.3-inch IPS Display
    Screen Resolution
    WQXGA (2560 x 1600)
    Hard Drives
    2 TB 4 x 4 NVMe SSD
    PSU
    USB-C / Thunderbolt 4 Power / Charging
    Mouse
    Buttonless Glass Precision Touchpad
    Keyboard
    Backlit, spill resistant keyboard
    Internet Speed
    1Gb Up / 1Gb Down
    Browser
    Edge
    Antivirus
    Windows Defender
    Other Info
    WiFi 6e / Bluetooth 5.1 / Facial Recognition / Fingerprint Sensor / ToF (Time of Flight) Human Presence Sensor
It is 100% proven fact that limiting the charge on LiIon batteries can increase their lifespan dramatically.
OK, show me the data that proves what you say.
I have spent years searching for the data but it has not been published in any publicly available space.

And you can cut out the deprecating remarks. I was an engineer as well.


Denis
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 11 Home x64 Version 23H2 Build 22631.3447
OK, show me the data that proves what you say.
I have spent years searching for the data but it has not been published in any publicly available space.

And you can cut out the deprecating remarks. I was an engineer as well.


Denis
I updated my post with a few links. Apologies if you took the remarks as deprecating, but I'll fight this one as there is a wealth of research indicating this.

NOTE: In the early days of LiIon batteries, this was not something that was well understood.

Again, just for clarification, I was not trying to come down on you personally. It's merely that I have seen assertions to the effect that that limiting the charge level affecting battery lifespan has no data behind it, when that is absolutely 100% provably false and it simply rubs me the wrong way :-).

Perhaps my response could have been more diplomatic. I apologize if I came on too strong.
 

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Win11 Pro 24H2
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Self-built
    CPU
    Intel i7 11700K
    Motherboard
    ASUS Prime Z590-A MB
    Memory
    64GB (Waiting for warranty replacement of another 64GB for 128GB total)
    Graphics Card(s)
    No GPU - Built-in Intel Graphics
    Sound Card
    Integrated
    Monitor(s) Displays
    HP Envy 32
    Screen Resolution
    2560 x 1440
    Hard Drives
    1 x 1TB NVMe SSD
    1 x 2TB NVMe SSD
    1 x 4TB NVMe SSD
    3 x 512GB 2.5" SSD
    1 x 4TB 2.5" SSD
    5 x 8TB Seagate Barracuda HDD
    PSU
    Corsair HX850i
    Case
    Corsair iCUE RGB 5000X mid tower case
    Cooling
    Noctua NF-S12A chromax.black.swap case fans (Qty. 7) & Home Computer Specifications, Configuration, and Usage Notes General Specifications ASUS Prime Z590-A motherboard, serial number M1M0KC222467ARP Intel Core i7-11700K CPU (11th Gen Rocket Lake / LGA 1200 Socket) 128GB Crucial Ballistix RGB DDR4 3200 MHz DRAM (4 x 32GB) Corsair iCUE RGB 5000X mid tower case Noctua NH-D15 chromax.black CPU cooler Noctua NF-S12A chromax.black.swap case fans (Qty. 7) & Corsair LL-120 RGB Fans (Qty. 3)
    Keyboard
    Corsair K70 Max RGB Magnetic Keyboard
    Mouse
    Logitech MX Master 3
    Internet Speed
    1Gb Up / 1 Gb Down
    Browser
    Edge
    Antivirus
    Windows Defender
    Other Info
    The five 8TB drives and three 512GB SSDs are part of a DrivePool using StableBit DrivePool software. The three SSDs are devoted purely to caching for the 8TB drives. All of the important data is stored in triplicate so that I can withstand simultaneous failure of 2 disks.

    Networking: 2.5Gbps Ethernet and WiFi 6e
  • Operating System
    Win11 Pro 23H2
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Lenovo ThinkBook 13x Gen 2
    CPU
    Intel i7-1255U
    Memory
    16 GB
    Graphics card(s)
    Intel Iris Xe Graphics
    Sound Card
    Realtek® ALC3306-CG codec
    Monitor(s) Displays
    13.3-inch IPS Display
    Screen Resolution
    WQXGA (2560 x 1600)
    Hard Drives
    2 TB 4 x 4 NVMe SSD
    PSU
    USB-C / Thunderbolt 4 Power / Charging
    Mouse
    Buttonless Glass Precision Touchpad
    Keyboard
    Backlit, spill resistant keyboard
    Internet Speed
    1Gb Up / 1Gb Down
    Browser
    Edge
    Antivirus
    Windows Defender
    Other Info
    WiFi 6e / Bluetooth 5.1 / Facial Recognition / Fingerprint Sensor / ToF (Time of Flight) Human Presence Sensor
When I suggested you "address" the update issues, what I meant was that I think you should let the current thread just sit here doing nothing while you focus your efforts on solving the update issues.


Best of luck,
Denis

But like I stated, I'm not having update issues. I always have them after installing MSI Center but I fix them but turning off the PC.

I'm going to very strongly debate that. It is 100% proven fact that limiting the charge on LiIon batteries can increase their lifespan dramatically.

The issue here is that this helps if you leave the LiIon battery fully charged for extended periods of time. Simply charging to 100% is not the issue. Rather, if your typical usage scenario is that you use the laptop (or other equipment) plugged in and allow it to sit with the battery fully charged for extended periods of time, this will 100% absolutely, guaranteed, result in a shorter lifespan than if you charged it to a lower level.

Don't misunderstand me - it's not like this will rapidly kill your battery. But it absolutely will make a difference. Many manufacturers see no need for addressing this because the battery is typically an easily replaceable part. However, in modern equipment that is sealed and not made for easy consumer replacement of the battery, hav9ng the ability to lengthen the lifespan of the battery makes sense.

This is not even up for debate. This is basic LiIon knowledge 101 for those of us with engineering and design backgrounds in LiIon battery charge management.

A cursory search in your favorite browser will yield much info on this topic.

EDIT: For a very simplistic discussion, see this article, especially the "Depth of Charge" section:


A more in depth discussion can be found here:


OK, show me the data that proves what you say.
I have spent years searching for the data but it has not been published in any publicly available space.

And you can cut out the deprecating remarks. I was an engineer as well.


Denis

I updated my post with a few links. Apologies if you took the remarks as deprecating, but I'll fight this one as there is a wealth of research indicating this.

NOTE: In the early days of LiIon batteries, this was not something that was well understood.

Again, just for clarification, I was not trying to come down on you personally. It's merely that I have seen assertions to the effect that that limiting the charge level affecting battery lifespan has no data behind it, when that is absolutely 100% provably false and it simply rubs me the wrong way :-).

Perhaps my response could have been more diplomatic. I apologize if I came on too strong.

Talking about the experience regarding my previous laptop (it was bought in 2019), I always leave it charging in the same place for years and its battery must have a problem since the laptop almost immediately turns off after taking its power cord.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 11
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    MSI Katana 15 B12VGK
    CPU
    Intel Core i7-12650H
    Memory
    16 GB (2x8 GB) DDR5-4800MHz SO-DIMM
    Graphics Card(s)
    Intel UHD Graphics + NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4070 Laptop GPU 8 GB GDDR6
    Monitor(s) Displays
    15.6" Full HD (1920x1080) 144Hz Refresh Rate 16:9 IPS Display
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080p
    Hard Drives
    SSD 1 TB NVMe PCIe Gen 4x4
    PSU
    240 W Power Supply
    Case
    Core Black
    Cooling
    Cooler Boost 5
    Keyboard
    Backlit keyboard with numeric keypad and PT-PT layout
    Internet Speed
    500 Mbps
    Browser
    Google Chrome
Hannes,

The pretentiously-named Battery university contains no data.
Furthermore, it deliberately obfuscates its data sources.
In addition to this, the site's author has been castigated in many Amazon user reviews of his book on the same subject. Several of his readers have accused him of crossing out NiCd and writing Li-ion in its place without altering any of the text itself.

Your clean technica link does not contain any data either but merely assertions.

there is a wealth of research indicating this
I have seen assertions to the effect that that limiting the charge level affecting battery lifespan has no data behind it
So show me the research data that you say exists.


The last time we were in a thread on this topic, I undertook to generate data for one particular computer & its two batteries.
When my experiment ends in July, I will be able to compare two years' Last full charge /Design charge for the batteries that have been limited to 80-90% charging against the records for the same batteries when they were allowed to charge to 100% for the preceding six & four years respectively.
I will not claim that the results have any broader application because the data does not exist to support such an assertion.
The results so far do not show any reduction in the gradual deterioration of Last full charge /Design charge ratios.


Denis
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 11 Home x64 Version 23H2 Build 22631.3447
Hannes,

The pretentiously-named Battery university contains no data.
Furthermore, it deliberately obfuscates its data sources.
In addition to this, the site's author has been castigated in many Amazon user reviews of his book on the same subject. Several of his readers have accused him of crossing out NiCd and writing Li-ion in its place without altering any of the text itself.

Your clean technica link does not contain any data either but merely assertions.



So show me the research data that you say exists.


The last time we were in a thread on this topic, I undertook to generate data for one particular computer & its two batteries.
When my experiment ends in July, I will be able to compare two years' Last full charge /Design charge for the batteries that have been limited to 80-90% charging against the records for the same batteries when they were allowed to charge to 100% for the preceding six & four years respectively.
I will not claim that the results have any broader application because the data does not exist to support such an assertion.
The results so far do not show any reduction in the gradual deterioration of Last full charge /Design charge ratios.


Denis

Then why is my previous laptop's battery likely damaged?
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 11
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    MSI Katana 15 B12VGK
    CPU
    Intel Core i7-12650H
    Memory
    16 GB (2x8 GB) DDR5-4800MHz SO-DIMM
    Graphics Card(s)
    Intel UHD Graphics + NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4070 Laptop GPU 8 GB GDDR6
    Monitor(s) Displays
    15.6" Full HD (1920x1080) 144Hz Refresh Rate 16:9 IPS Display
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080p
    Hard Drives
    SSD 1 TB NVMe PCIe Gen 4x4
    PSU
    240 W Power Supply
    Case
    Core Black
    Cooling
    Cooler Boost 5
    Keyboard
    Backlit keyboard with numeric keypad and PT-PT layout
    Internet Speed
    500 Mbps
    Browser
    Google Chrome
I have no idea.

Denis
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 11 Home x64 Version 23H2 Build 22631.3447
Denis, I'll look for some research when I have the opportunity later today. But in the meantime, simply consider this:

If there was no truth why would Sony, ASUS, Dell, Apple, Tesla, etc. all go to the trouble of providing functionality to limit charge levels? These are people who really know the technology. They are not going to waste development cycles for nothing.

That alone should be enough proof.
 

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Win11 Pro 24H2
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Self-built
    CPU
    Intel i7 11700K
    Motherboard
    ASUS Prime Z590-A MB
    Memory
    64GB (Waiting for warranty replacement of another 64GB for 128GB total)
    Graphics Card(s)
    No GPU - Built-in Intel Graphics
    Sound Card
    Integrated
    Monitor(s) Displays
    HP Envy 32
    Screen Resolution
    2560 x 1440
    Hard Drives
    1 x 1TB NVMe SSD
    1 x 2TB NVMe SSD
    1 x 4TB NVMe SSD
    3 x 512GB 2.5" SSD
    1 x 4TB 2.5" SSD
    5 x 8TB Seagate Barracuda HDD
    PSU
    Corsair HX850i
    Case
    Corsair iCUE RGB 5000X mid tower case
    Cooling
    Noctua NF-S12A chromax.black.swap case fans (Qty. 7) & Home Computer Specifications, Configuration, and Usage Notes General Specifications ASUS Prime Z590-A motherboard, serial number M1M0KC222467ARP Intel Core i7-11700K CPU (11th Gen Rocket Lake / LGA 1200 Socket) 128GB Crucial Ballistix RGB DDR4 3200 MHz DRAM (4 x 32GB) Corsair iCUE RGB 5000X mid tower case Noctua NH-D15 chromax.black CPU cooler Noctua NF-S12A chromax.black.swap case fans (Qty. 7) & Corsair LL-120 RGB Fans (Qty. 3)
    Keyboard
    Corsair K70 Max RGB Magnetic Keyboard
    Mouse
    Logitech MX Master 3
    Internet Speed
    1Gb Up / 1 Gb Down
    Browser
    Edge
    Antivirus
    Windows Defender
    Other Info
    The five 8TB drives and three 512GB SSDs are part of a DrivePool using StableBit DrivePool software. The three SSDs are devoted purely to caching for the 8TB drives. All of the important data is stored in triplicate so that I can withstand simultaneous failure of 2 disks.

    Networking: 2.5Gbps Ethernet and WiFi 6e
  • Operating System
    Win11 Pro 23H2
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Lenovo ThinkBook 13x Gen 2
    CPU
    Intel i7-1255U
    Memory
    16 GB
    Graphics card(s)
    Intel Iris Xe Graphics
    Sound Card
    Realtek® ALC3306-CG codec
    Monitor(s) Displays
    13.3-inch IPS Display
    Screen Resolution
    WQXGA (2560 x 1600)
    Hard Drives
    2 TB 4 x 4 NVMe SSD
    PSU
    USB-C / Thunderbolt 4 Power / Charging
    Mouse
    Buttonless Glass Precision Touchpad
    Keyboard
    Backlit, spill resistant keyboard
    Internet Speed
    1Gb Up / 1Gb Down
    Browser
    Edge
    Antivirus
    Windows Defender
    Other Info
    WiFi 6e / Bluetooth 5.1 / Facial Recognition / Fingerprint Sensor / ToF (Time of Flight) Human Presence Sensor
Denis, I'll look for some research when I have the opportunity later today. But in the meantime, simply consider this:

If there was no truth why would Sony, ASUS, Dell, Apple, Tesla, etc. all go to the trouble of providing functionality to limit charge levels? These are people who really know the technology. They are not going to waste development cycles for nothing.

That alone should be enough proof.

Tahat's what I thought. Then why does this feature even exist in MSI Center?
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 11
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    MSI Katana 15 B12VGK
    CPU
    Intel Core i7-12650H
    Memory
    16 GB (2x8 GB) DDR5-4800MHz SO-DIMM
    Graphics Card(s)
    Intel UHD Graphics + NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4070 Laptop GPU 8 GB GDDR6
    Monitor(s) Displays
    15.6" Full HD (1920x1080) 144Hz Refresh Rate 16:9 IPS Display
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080p
    Hard Drives
    SSD 1 TB NVMe PCIe Gen 4x4
    PSU
    240 W Power Supply
    Case
    Core Black
    Cooling
    Cooler Boost 5
    Keyboard
    Backlit keyboard with numeric keypad and PT-PT layout
    Internet Speed
    500 Mbps
    Browser
    Google Chrome
Dell tech support released revised advice saying that charge-limiting makes no difference [again, no data was referenced]. I gave you a link to that in July 2021 in a thread in which a TF member had reported that Dell's power utility no longer included charge-limiting.
Other TF members have reported the same for HP and, last month, I had my hands on a new HP laptop for a week and was able to see for myself that it had no charge-limiting capability.
That alone should be enough proof.
It is no proof at all. It is merely an inference that proof might exist. That's been my problem all the way through - there are plenty of inferences & there are plenty of assertions but there is no data.


I started searching for available data in 2016. I expected to find it and would then be able to use it in considering how best to manage my own batteries.


Denis
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 11 Home x64 Version 23H2 Build 22631.3447
I'm not making this pretty, here's a bunch of listings that all echo my assertions jumbled together. No time for pretty :-)

All I'm saying with this info is that this is how I was taught when I was implementing LiIon charging circuits. Could this all be wrong? Maybe. But it's how I was taught and I'm still a believer in it.


ElectronicDesign


Perhaps one of the worst locations for a Li-ion battery is in a laptop computer when used daily on a desktop with the charger connected. Laptops typically run warm or even hot, raising the battery temperature, and the charger is maintaining the battery near 100% charge. Both of these conditions shorten battery life, which could be as short as six months to a year. If possible, the user should be instructed to remove the battery and use the ac adapter for powering the laptop when used as a desktop computer. A properly cared for laptop battery can have a service life of two to four years or more.

Using partial-discharge cycles can greatly increase cycle life, and charging to less than 100% capacity can increase battery life even further.

Use partial-discharge cycles
Using only 20% or 30% of the battery capacity before recharging will extend cycle life considerably. As a general rule, 5 to 10 shallow discharge cycles are equal to one full discharge cycle. Although partial-discharge cycles can number in the thousands, keeping the battery in a fully charged state also shortens battery life. Full discharge cycles (down to 2.5 V or 3 V, depending on chemistry) should be avoided if possible.

Avoid charging to 100% capacity
Selecting a lower float voltage can do this. Reducing the float voltage will increase cycle life and service life at the expense of reduced battery capacity. A 100-mV to 300-mV drop in float voltage can increase cycle life from two to five times or more. Li-ion cobalt chemistries are more sensitive to a higher float voltage than other chemistries. Li-ion phosphate cells typically have a lower float voltage than the more common Li-ion batteries.


From the Microsoft Document called "Caring for your surface battery"


When using your device, make sure the battery drains below 50 percent regularly. This will help minimize aging of the battery cells.

Keeping or storing at a high state of charge: Batteries maintained at a high charge state will lose capacity faster. You can help prevent this accelerated process by not leaving your device connected to AC power for extended periods. Rather, try to ensure the device is regularly discharged below 50% before charging again. If you have a scenario where you need to keep the device plugged in continuously, we recommend using the Battery Limit Mode to limit the battery state of charge. If you need to store your device for a long period of time, it’s best to reduce the charge level to 50% before storing and to regularly check the battery to ensure it has not drained to very low levels.

Battery Limit Mode - Battery Limit Mode is a feature available for users who need to keep devices plugged in for extended periods of time. Plugging in the device for extended periods of time can cause batteries to prematurely age. When enabled this feature limits battery charging capacity to 50%, which slows the aging process and prolongs battery longevity.

From the Journal of Energy Storage: Strategies to limit degradation and maximize Li-ion battery service lifetime - Critical review and guidance for stakeholders


See the graphical abstract and asociated text.


From battery manufacturers:

EEMB (eemb.com)

Long-term Storage
The cell should be used within a short period after charging because long-term storage may cause
loss of capacity by self-discharging. If the cell is kept for a long time(3months or more), It is strongly
recommended that the cell isstored at dry and low-temperature and Keep the cell(s) at a half-charged
state. the cell should be shipped in 50% charged state. In this case, OCV is from 3.65V to 3.85V. Our
shipping voltage is 3.75-3.80v . because storage at higher voltage may cause loss of characteristics.
- over a period of 1 month: -5 ~ 35℃, relative humidity: ≤75%. - over a period of 6 months:
-20~ 25℃, relative humidity: ≤75%.


Battery data sheets often speficy that best storage practices dictate stoargae at levels well below 100% as this increases longevity of the batteries. Here is but a single example:


From the Panasonic Lithium Ion Batteries Technical Handbook:


Storing the Batteries
The batteries should be stored at room temperature, charged to about 30 to 50% of capacity.
We recommend that batteries be charged about once per year to prevent overdischarge.

Other sources:

DigitalTrends: You shouldn’t leave your laptop in this state all the time, though, just when you’d drain the battery very quickly. As mentioned, it’s better to store your battery at 40% to 50% capacity than it is to store it at 100% capacity if you don’t plan on using it for a bit. Degradation is faster on fully charged, unattended batteries, especially at high temperatures.


Tesla: Tesla recommends that if you are planning a long trip that requires near 100% charge that you set the timer to result in a full charge finishing within 60 minutes of departure. The idea here is to be fully topped off for as short an amount of time as possible.

Aceleron: For those of you who are battery fanatics and want to know the science behind charging your battery, here are some technical details:
For a lithium battery the structure of the positive terminal is variable when it is depleted of electrons for long periods of time, which can lead to permanent capacity loss. However, lithium’s low self-discharge rate means, that it does not need to be stored at 100% state of charge (SoC). In fact, a lithium battery should be stored near 50% state of charge – which equally distributes the electrons on the positive and negative terminals.

Or more simply, lithium battery chemistry is a bit like a hydro dam’s reservoir. In an ideal world, it would be best to keep the reservoir half full. An empty reservoir, and you have no power; but an overfilled dam can cause issues that damage the dam (overflow etc).



I know that you didn't trust the study from Battery University (although this was in fact an in depth study), but it might be worth noting that the following article from Steve Burke of Gamers Nexus also cites this as a source:


See the text of the article for more info.
 

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Win11 Pro 24H2
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Self-built
    CPU
    Intel i7 11700K
    Motherboard
    ASUS Prime Z590-A MB
    Memory
    64GB (Waiting for warranty replacement of another 64GB for 128GB total)
    Graphics Card(s)
    No GPU - Built-in Intel Graphics
    Sound Card
    Integrated
    Monitor(s) Displays
    HP Envy 32
    Screen Resolution
    2560 x 1440
    Hard Drives
    1 x 1TB NVMe SSD
    1 x 2TB NVMe SSD
    1 x 4TB NVMe SSD
    3 x 512GB 2.5" SSD
    1 x 4TB 2.5" SSD
    5 x 8TB Seagate Barracuda HDD
    PSU
    Corsair HX850i
    Case
    Corsair iCUE RGB 5000X mid tower case
    Cooling
    Noctua NF-S12A chromax.black.swap case fans (Qty. 7) & Home Computer Specifications, Configuration, and Usage Notes General Specifications ASUS Prime Z590-A motherboard, serial number M1M0KC222467ARP Intel Core i7-11700K CPU (11th Gen Rocket Lake / LGA 1200 Socket) 128GB Crucial Ballistix RGB DDR4 3200 MHz DRAM (4 x 32GB) Corsair iCUE RGB 5000X mid tower case Noctua NH-D15 chromax.black CPU cooler Noctua NF-S12A chromax.black.swap case fans (Qty. 7) & Corsair LL-120 RGB Fans (Qty. 3)
    Keyboard
    Corsair K70 Max RGB Magnetic Keyboard
    Mouse
    Logitech MX Master 3
    Internet Speed
    1Gb Up / 1 Gb Down
    Browser
    Edge
    Antivirus
    Windows Defender
    Other Info
    The five 8TB drives and three 512GB SSDs are part of a DrivePool using StableBit DrivePool software. The three SSDs are devoted purely to caching for the 8TB drives. All of the important data is stored in triplicate so that I can withstand simultaneous failure of 2 disks.

    Networking: 2.5Gbps Ethernet and WiFi 6e
  • Operating System
    Win11 Pro 23H2
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Lenovo ThinkBook 13x Gen 2
    CPU
    Intel i7-1255U
    Memory
    16 GB
    Graphics card(s)
    Intel Iris Xe Graphics
    Sound Card
    Realtek® ALC3306-CG codec
    Monitor(s) Displays
    13.3-inch IPS Display
    Screen Resolution
    WQXGA (2560 x 1600)
    Hard Drives
    2 TB 4 x 4 NVMe SSD
    PSU
    USB-C / Thunderbolt 4 Power / Charging
    Mouse
    Buttonless Glass Precision Touchpad
    Keyboard
    Backlit, spill resistant keyboard
    Internet Speed
    1Gb Up / 1Gb Down
    Browser
    Edge
    Antivirus
    Windows Defender
    Other Info
    WiFi 6e / Bluetooth 5.1 / Facial Recognition / Fingerprint Sensor / ToF (Time of Flight) Human Presence Sensor
Every time I update the BIOS (MSI is delivering BIOS updates often), even though MSI Center set the battery to be only charged until 60%, it passes that limit and reaches 100%. I have to change this setting and afterwards change to the former setting for it to only charge until 60%.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 11
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    MSI Katana 15 B12VGK
    CPU
    Intel Core i7-12650H
    Memory
    16 GB (2x8 GB) DDR5-4800MHz SO-DIMM
    Graphics Card(s)
    Intel UHD Graphics + NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4070 Laptop GPU 8 GB GDDR6
    Monitor(s) Displays
    15.6" Full HD (1920x1080) 144Hz Refresh Rate 16:9 IPS Display
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080p
    Hard Drives
    SSD 1 TB NVMe PCIe Gen 4x4
    PSU
    240 W Power Supply
    Case
    Core Black
    Cooling
    Cooler Boost 5
    Keyboard
    Backlit keyboard with numeric keypad and PT-PT layout
    Internet Speed
    500 Mbps
    Browser
    Google Chrome
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