Thoughts on Windows 11

Superfly · Nov 13, 2021

z3r010 said:
What's the difference between Microsoft 365 and Office 2021? - Microsoft Support

Learn about the differences between a Microsoft 365 subscription, Office 2016, and the free Office Online apps.

support.microsoft.com

Thanx John, interesting hey? Must say I find O365 a lot slower (maybe network) but still I prefer O2019
I

cereberus · Nov 13, 2021

Cbleman said:
Yup.
A license for a single version. Like I said before. Each person has different needs. Me, I don't want or need the latest version. I get updates, and patches to make my version compatible with the "Latest Version". Version changes have not always been good to me. Because of my job I always had to be very familiar with the latest versions of Windows and Office. That doesn't mean I had to like them though. I have always felt that the subscription fees are a little like repurchasing a license for the license I have already paid for.
Updates have been traditionally supported by those that purchase a license after me, so I sleep very well at night accepting these updates. Office is not cheap, and this is a situation where business and corporate licenses help support the little guy.

People compare orangles and apples.

Buy Office - you get a licence to use it in 1 pc and no updates yo next major version.

Lease Office Personal - you get a licence to use it on 6 PCs, all updates and 1 TB cloud space.

For a little extra, you can have up to 6 users, each with 1 TB cloud space, and each user can install on 6 devices. This is phenomenal value for families.

In fact, if you compare cost of buying it every three years {typical release between major builds) versus leasing, leaaing os better value.

Of course, if you choose not to upgrade a purchased version, it mist be cheaper over the long term. It all depends on what you use it for.

If it is used for work puposes, keeping upto date can be important.

So there is no right or wrong.

Note: many companies offer a 30% discount if you buy a personal copy of 365. The beauty of this deal is you continue to get the deal if you leave the company. I get the full lease multi user lease deal for around £60 pa.

Each user has to decide what suits them.

The same will apply if MS introduce leasing for Windows. They will never charge for the base OS, but could conceivably charge for premium features like many major software developers. Of course, this is pure speculation and we have no evidence to support this other than a vague conspiracy type of theory i.e. "they do it for Office, so bound to do it for Windows".

fatz2fly · Nov 13, 2021

wabbit said:
I'm currently running Windows 11 on an old unsupported laptop with no TPM, no secure boot, and a legacy BIOS. While some thing have changed from Windows 10, I like it, but not overly excited about it. Basically just did a clean install and only aade Office 365, Google Chrome, and Macrium reflect to it just to check out W11.

I have a newer Dell laptop which meets all the requirements to update to 11, but I'm waiting until it's offered on WU. Also have a HP desktop with W10, which is primarily used by the SO, and as a file server. Tthat system does not qualify for W11 and won't upgrade it

I have three systems that qualify and one - i7-7700 - that does not qualify. It is a very robust system and not ready for replacement. I will wait until that qualifies. Then I may give it a test drive. If not, I will wait as long as possible.

Winuser · Nov 13, 2021

fatz2fly said:
I have three systems that qualify and one - i7-7700 - that does not qualify. It is a very robust system and not ready for replacement. I will wait until that qualifies. Then I may give it a test drive. If not, I will wait as long as possible.

Even if your i7 7700 never qualifies to run Win 11 there is no need to be concerned. Win 10 is still going to be supported until October 14th, 2025. MS may even decide to extend that date.

highlander · Nov 14, 2021

The problem is that they are changing for the sake of changing without understanding that people have been using windows with the same format for 25 years. You just don't move away from that. That being said, they way they view it is that in 20 years the old generation would have adapted and the new generation would know not know what they are missing.

The fact that we have the ability to revert back should be something MS should be keeping an eye on and revert if the demand is there. You just can't make it better than the old system and taskbar.

Having quicklaunch with ALL my programs in there is highly beneficial than having a cluttered up Desktop. What they need to do is go one step beyond and make it save into your account so you can transfer over between PCs and/or upgrades.

W11 is a must for me because it fixes the issue of connecting and disconnecting monitors that i definitely hate from w10 and that alone is worth the upgrade as long as I can have my legacy taskbar (which you can).

W7 start button and menu was pinnacle and all they had to do was improve the search like they are doing here and add more features to it to make the setup work at a glance. They are so focused on competing with Apple that they forget that people won't jump over.

FJRMarty · Nov 14, 2021

New guy here, just checking in. Started in the 80's with a 2-floppy 512K desktop. Sept 28 my 11 yr old laptop quit, over the years had upgraded from Win 7 to latest Win 10 21H1 with no issues until the GPU suddenly stopped, black screen. My new 2 week old Dell comes with W11, and while I am noob W11 user I am in wonder and awe of the big advancement of rounded menu corners...

Looking forward to learning Windows 11 tips and tricks!

exploder · Nov 14, 2021

I have two systems running Windows 11. I have been running Windows for about two years now, Windows 10 up until the release of 11. I had been a Linux user for around 16 years. Recently, I wanted to look at alternatives for older systems that do not qualify for Windows 11.

KDE Neon seemed like a good starting point because it is most similar to Windows as far as looking modern. Let's face it, many Linux distros seem to be stuck in the 90's as far as appearance is concerned. The majority of complaints about Windows 11 are because of the hardware requirements and very little ability to customize it.

Plasma Desktop 5.23 is KDE's 25th anniversary edition, on Neon you always have the latest KDE. The default menu is excellent! If you don't like it there are alternatives just a couple of moue clicks away.The desktop can be made to look just about any way you want, it is very customizable! It can run on old hardware quite well too.

Windows 10 is decent but eventually support will end. There are a lot of great older computers out there like the older Dell Precision's I have. I am not about to get rid of systems that have 128 GB of RAM, dual Xeon processors, etc because Microsoft decided they are not secure enough, they suit my needs just fine. Also, parts and new systems are very expensive!

I still want a modern looking system and Plasma 5 does look really nice! An avid gamer would not be happy running Linux, Windows is far superior for gaming. I game a little but Steam keeps getting better and there are a decent amount of titles available, so I can live with that. I can use snaps, flatpack's and app images to keep applications on the latest versions if I want.

I installed the flatpack for LibreOffice and it works great! I would not recommend KDE Neon for inexperienced users but Kubuntu will soon release a new LTS that would serve new users well. Most of Windows 11's new features have been in Linux distros for years, virtual desktops, rounded corners, compositing, etc.

Linux is not for everyone, if you are a hardcore gamer you would not be happy. If you just want a modern look, customization, and a future upgrade path, a KDE based distro might be worth looking at. I have no plans of switching all my systems to Linux but all my Precision systems are in pretty much brand new condition and I want to keep them in use.

Some had mentioned looking at Linux so I thought I would share my experience.

Winuser · Nov 14, 2021

FJRMarty said:
New guy here, just checking in. Started in the 80's with a 2-floppy 512K desktop. Sept 28 my 11 yr old laptop quit, over the years had upgraded from Win 7 to latest Win 10 21H1 with no issues until the GPU suddenly stopped, black screen. My new 2 week old Dell comes with W11, and while I am noob W11 user I am in wonder and awe of the big advancement of rounded menu corners...
Looking forward to learning Windows 11 tips and tricks!

Welcome to the forum! You will definitely learn a lot of tips and tricks about Win 11 here.

hdmi · Nov 14, 2021

exploder said:
I have two systems running Windows 11. I have been running Windows for about two years now, Windows 10 up until the release of 11. I had been a Linux user for around 16 years. Recently, I wanted to look at alternatives for older systems that do not qualify for Windows 11.

KDE Neon seemed like a good starting point because it is most similar to Windows as far as looking modern. Let's face it, many Linux distros seem to be stuck in the 90's as far as appearance is concerned. The majority of complaints about Windows 11 are because of the hardware requirements and very little ability to customize it.

Plasma Desktop 5.23 is KDE's 25th anniversary edition, on Neon you always have the latest KDE. The default menu is excellent! If you don't like it there are alternatives just a couple of moue clicks away.The desktop can be made to look just about any way you want, it is very customizable! It can run on old hardware quite well too.

Windows 10 is decent but eventually support will end. There are a lot of great older computers out there like the older Dell Precision's I have. I am not about to get rid of systems that have 128 GB of RAM, dual Xeon processors, etc because Microsoft decided they are not secure enough, they suit my needs just fine. Also, parts and new systems are very expensive!

I still want a modern looking system and Plasma 5 does look really nice! An avid gamer would not be happy running Linux, Windows is far superior for gaming. I game a little but Steam keeps getting better and there are a decent amount of titles available, so I can live with that. I can use snaps, flatpack's and app images to keep applications on the latest versions if I want.

I installed the flatpack for LibreOffice and it works great! I would not recommend KDE Neon for inexperienced users but Kubuntu will soon release a new LTS that would serve new users well. Most of Windows 11's new features have been in Linux distros for years, virtual desktops, rounded corners, compositing, etc.

Linux is not for everyone, if you are a hardcore gamer you would not be happy. If you just want a modern look, customization, and a future upgrade path, a KDE based distro might be worth looking at. I have no plans of switching all my systems to Linux but all my Precision systems are in pretty much brand new condition and I want to keep them in use.

Some had mentioned looking at Linux so I thought I would share my experience.

My thoughts on Windows 11 versus Linux are pretty much identical to what's been outlined in this post, by and large. Windows has a much larger user base, so there's always enough information to be found on the internet, either to get things fixed or to obtain an alternative solution or method that works. In addition to this, some of the hardware that I have either is not or is poorly supported on Linux. Last but not least, software on Linux is still lacking because it very often doesn't let me do what I want to do, HOW I want to do it. Booting into Linux only to find out a few moments later that I need to boot right back into Windows is just that: an obvious dead end... simple plain.

Cbleman · Nov 14, 2021

barman58 said:
Now if you are someone who does not want or need to be completely up to date Photoshop CS6 still works and of course there are a lot of alternatives available at one off prices lower than Photoshop was, some even lower than the ongoing cost of the Photography package, Some good ones can be found for free but I still believe that adobe still lead their field and so continue with the subscription, I also use a number of other packages from adobe's competitors as they may do certain tasks quicker/better/easier than photoshop - All my images are initially processed and managed in lightroom as always

I agree adobe is the Cadillac of photo editing software.
GIMP editor is a tremendously powerful tool also. Although it's free, very few (almost nobody) who uses adobe now, want(s) to go through the very high learning curve that it would take to effectively use that software to accomplish what they are currently doing in Adobe easily, right now. Menu options are in odd places that are not necessarily intuitive, and in some cases, tasks are simply more complicated than Adobe. You would have to do research on how to use the new software, then re-train yourself to use it effectively. Even then, some things in Adobe are just easier.
Microsoft needs to keep this in mind when they revise Windows. Burying menu options that people use in a raft of non-intuitive submenus; taking features out and making users jump through hoops to acquire third party software and learn how to use it, making what was once easy difficult, (I feel) is not an upgrade. You have to do research on how to effectively use the new software, then re-train yourself to use it effectively. Even then, some things in the previous version were just easier.
What's the difference? Well... I believe that the Open Source programmers who work on GIMP are not apathetic to the needs and wants of the users. Not that I believe that MS is TOTALY apathetic. After all; after four or five years and much whining, we finally got the up arrow button back. I guess they DO listen. Sorta.

Cbleman · Nov 14, 2021

Superfly said:
Yep Nige, that was my impression as well, I was just wondering if O365 got preference regarding updates - I have O365 on my corporate PC - will check versions on Monday.

Btw notice they misspelled "Colourful" .. LOL

It seems we "Yanks" have difficulty with some spellings.

Cbleman · Nov 20, 2021

The Pool Man said:
I don't know if I was clear with my 25% comment. It means while Win 11 emerges and changes 'too much' they'd also maintain Win 10. That way the Changephobics could delight in their stagnant OS to their hearts content. Meanwhile --

-- 11 could proceed into the future. Or really catch up to the recent past.

I

It's not stagnant if the new iteration is a downgrade because the previous one had more functionality that was removed. I don't consider myself a Change-o-phobic if the new iteration doesn't work at least as well (for me) as the previous one because tools I need have been removed, and negatively impacts my productivity because of that fact.
I understand that not everyone will be impacted to the same degree, and some will not mind the missing tools. I'm actually happy for those people. A "get over it" attitude by those same people however, I don't understand. From the comments on this thread alone, there are a quite a number of people who were negatively impacted because MS stripped some functionality from the new OS. Was crippling the software by removing needed features really necessary? It has been stressed here time and again, that different people work differently. Just because someone else wasn't as negatively impacted as I, doesn't mean that I should "Get over it".
No, MS cannot please everyone. Removing tools or features that negatively impacts productivity for a sizeable group, does not help help nor please anyone. If the tool or feature was never implemented that's one thing. Removing these tools or features simply because they can is another. I don't think it hurts anything to leave in a tool or feature someone else will never use, but others do. I also don't think third party options are or should be the answer to blatant high handed removal of needed tools that were already in the OS. .....but that's just me.

clam1952 · Nov 20, 2021

As I spend more time actually using programs than looking at Taskbars menus and such, I'm not really bothered if the interface is different, after a few weeks, I can easily work round or fix the missing and different elements, no more different to adapting any of the dozens of non MS operating systems I've easily adapted to over the years and at least those IMO dreadful space hogging tiles have gone, first thing I got rid of in Win10.

Cbleman · Dec 11, 2021

clam1952 said:
As I spend more time actually using programs than looking at Taskbars menus and such, I'm not really bothered if the interface is different, after a few weeks, I can easily work round or fix the missing and different elements, no more different to adapting any of the dozens of non MS operating systems I've easily adapted to over the years and at least those IMO dreadful space hogging tiles have gone, first thing I got rid of in Win10.

It still irks me that menus that were only one click away have been buried and moved. I not only need to find them, I also need one to four clicks more to do the same thing. It also irks me that I need third party software to restore functionality that was included in the previous UI, and to restore the task bar to something I'm used to so it's functional again for the way I work. Microsoft's exclusion of certain newer processors, and draconian hardware requirements leave me dumfounded. Even some hardware that meets their "Security" requirements have been excluded. I DO look at the taskbars and menus, because not only I have to USE them, removing functionality from those elements negatively impacts me. Nobody should need "work arounds" or "fixes" to overcome deliberately introduced inadequacies in the UI.

As I said in a previous post there ARE good things in Win 11. Although I'm sure there are some that will miss them, I agree, that getting rid of those "Live Tiles" was one of those decisions.

That being said, I HAVE installed the third party software. I HAVE learned the new locations of menus and functions. I DO admit that some of my gripes seem petty, and even though I resented learning (being forced to learn) a new way of doing things, I HAVE adapted.
Windows 10 will stay on the non supported hardware. I will not recommend to anyone that they buy new hardware to use this latest iteration of windows. Hopefully in four years, the landfills will not be overwhelmed with old but still serviceable hardware made obsolete due to lack of support by one company. Who knows? Maybe in four more years someone will have found the answer, and made the breakthrough to quantum computing! (I'm not holding my breath.)
As for the rest of my gripes; I have decided to just "get over it", and join the herd. (Not that I'll stop complaining about shortcomings...) I have decided that I will be moving forward with Windows 11. moo?

Note: Running Windows 11 on my graphics and video editing rig. It does not seem any faster than Windows 10.

Cbleman · Dec 12, 2021

Update: It seems that I have to go back to Windows 10 to regain functionality.

As I mentioned in my previous post, I put Win 11 on my Graphics and Video Rig. Even though I have an I7 possessor that meets all of the security requirements on my office\server computer, that particular one seems to have been excluded from the upgrade list. I was very reluctant to alter the UI/OS on the Graphics and Video Rig. I even went so far as to use a friends computer that had Windows 11 on it, but that wasn't working for me either. In the end, I just took the plunge, and made the change, in spite of my misgivings about 11.
I have been working with Windows 11 for the past few weeks in order to learn, and become more familiar with the UI, and see which of my gripes were petty, and just a matter of frustration over being forced to relearn the changed UI. Unfortunately this particular loss is just to much for me to "work around" or "get over".

The Folder.jpg functionality has been around for a very long time. Over the years, I have grown used to the visual aid and aesthetics this function provides. Photographers, artists, graphic designers, collectors and multi media people that I personally know, use this feature. I feel it's a huge loss to a huge user base, and that it would be a disservice by Microsoft to its users and some businesses, to allow this loss to continue.

Since most of my video, music and graphic files have been transferred to the server, I didn't notice that Folder.jpg functionality (Putting a picture on the outside of a folder) has been removed in Windows 11. This was the last straw. I have installed the third party software, worked the work arounds and tried valiantly to adapt and overcome. For me, this crippling removal of functionality is just to much for me to overcome.

Every Video, Music file or graphic on my network is in a folder with Cover art, a Movie Poster or Thumbnail to act as a visual aid for what is in the folder. In some cases, a picture of a program graphic is on a folder to visually speed identification of that folder in a crowded directory. I will NOT go back and create an Icon for literally thousands of folders because somebody in authority who doesn't use that function decided that I don't need it and took it out. I don't think third party software and a batch file are going to fix this one. I don't know what I'm going to do in four more years if MS doesn't put this feature back. I guess that I have four years to figure it out. I have posted in the feedback hub. For those that want to give my cause an upvote, it would be appreciated.

If there is anyone out there who knows of a fast and EASY work around for this problem, please let me know. I will be monitoring my E-mail for a response.

To everyone subscribed to this thread, It's been a hoot. I have enjoyed the posts from everyone. Even those whom I disagree with and/or disagree with me. This has been a learning experience, and it's been a pleasure interacting with you all.
Thank you

Fabler2 · Dec 13, 2021

@Cbleman share your Feedback link here and I'll upvote.

FDretired · Dec 13, 2021

I have switched to windows 11 after hardware upgrade about 5 weeks ago.

Here is a summary of what annoys me a LITTLE

I cannot make Ifran view as my default jpeg file viewer.

I love the rest of the changes from windows 10

I have overcome two annoyances with these changes.

1) Combined open icons in task bar. I have overcome this by using taskview which I did not use previously.

2) "Show more options" context menu. I have been able to disable this with this command posted on this forum.

Enable or Disable "Show more options" context menu using Command

1 Open Windows Terminal, and select Windows PowerShell or Command Prompt.

2 Copy and paste the command below you want into Windows Terminal, and press Enter.

(Disable)
reg add "HKCU\Software\Classes\CLSID\{86ca1aa0-34aa-4e8b-a509-50c905bae2a2}\InprocServer32" /f /ve

OR

(Enable)
reg delete "HKCU\Software\Classes\CLSID\{86ca1aa0-34aa-4e8b-a509-50c905bae2a2}" /f

3 Close Windows Terminal.

4 You may need to either restart the explorer process, sign out and sign in, or restart the computer to apply.

The-Hive · Dec 13, 2021

If you try to change Irfanview from settings it does not appear, if you right click a jpeg file and open with, select Irfanview and check the box to always open with that program, should do it.

FDretired · Dec 13, 2021

The-Hive said:
If you try to change Irfanview from settings it does not appear, if you right click a jpeg file and open with, select Irfanview and check the box to always open with that program, should do it.

The option "always open" is missing with JPEG files in Windows 11.

Bree · Dec 13, 2021

FDretired said:
I cannot make Ifran view as my default jpeg file viewer.

You've not tried hard enough.....

Right-click on a .jpeg, choose Open with > Choose another app. Scroll down and click More apps, scroll down and click Look for another app on this PC. Browse and find your Irfanview.exe.

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