Linux VM's - Newer distro VM's on HYPER-V - RDP won't work any more (Wayland video / X-server instead of X11/XORG)

Hi folks
If you use typically HYPER-V to create VM's and you create a desktop Linux VM e.g any distro with a Windowed GUI desktop e.g GNOME,MINT,KDE etc then newer distros have now dropped support for the old X-Server based on XORG and X11 and switched to Wayland. This means that you can't RDP any more but have to use the HYPER-V connect application.

The problem is that RDP is proprietary source by Ms and has mainly 32 bit code in it and since Wayland is essentially 64 bit code it's not compatible with RDP - and not "fixable" by linux developers It's a 100% Ms problem.

If you need remote access to hyper-V linux VM's then you'll need something like a VNC viewer installed on the Windows side -- i.e if you have say a HYPER-VM running on Machine 1 and you want to connect to it remotely from Laptop 2 not using the HYPER-V connect application then that's where you'll need to install the viewer.

A semi-get around is to install the cockpit application on the Linux VM and then you get some sort of widowed access from a browser via https://servername<or IP address>:9200 but you won't be able to run windowed apps.

RDP in any case is a slowish protocol and not very secure anyway.

Developments I'm sure will evenually sort this out. Older distros still using X11/XORG such as debian / ubuntu work from windows to connect to a remote hyper-V via RDP. If you have a distro that allows a choice at login of X11/Wayland then if you use the X11 to RDP that will still work-- but X11 /XORGG is old, poor security (not encrypted) and not very good with moden high powered graphic / video cards.

Cheers
jimbo

The main issue is if a Linux distro cannot act as an rdp server, it can only be run in basic mode, with main limitation being no sound.

cereberus said:

The main issue is if a Linux distro cannot act as an rdp server, it can only be run in basic mode, with main limitation being no sound.

Click to expand...

Actually I'd have to not "technically"disagree with that as it's correct but -- the main problem is much more fundamental -- problem is in the Video and proprietary Ms RDP protocols -- sound is an issue with HYPER-V only being able to accept USB "Disk type devices" (unless you have appropriate hardware and have set IOMMX so passthru hardware can work). X11 / XORG / XRANDR are effectively as dead as the dodo - you can still use the venerable Debian LTS Linux system if you need that stuff but even Debian will eventually change.

Most Linux users aren't going into "Windows reverse engineering mode" in trying to create "X11-Wayland" type video bridges so RDP still works. RDP itself is still relatively a slow and not very secure protocol. Nothing wrong in using a decent VNC server on Windows if you need to run Linux full video type applications.

Cheers
jimbo

jimbo45 said:

Actually I'd have to not "technically"disagree with that as it's correct but -- the main problem is much more fundamental -- problem is in the Video and proprietary Ms RDP protocols -- sound is an issue with HYPER-V only being able to accept USB "Disk type devices" (unless you have appropriate hardware and have set IOMMX so passthru hardware can work). X11 / XORG / XRANDR are effectively as dead as the dodo - you can still use the venerable Debian LTS Linux system if you need that stuff but even Debian will eventually change.

Most Linux users aren't going into "Windows reverse engineering mode" in trying to create "X11-Wayland" type video bridges so RDP still works. RDP itself is still relatively a slow and not very secure protocol. Nothing wrong in using a decent VNC server on Windows if you need to run Linux full video type applications.

Cheers
jimbo

Click to expand...

What is more fundamental than no sound (no vision I suppose lol)?

All these other aspects, such as lack of usb support in basic mode can be got around by copying usb contents to onedrive or a virtual hard drive.

You should look at things from a Windows perspective - most people running Linux distros in Hyper-v just want to load one up in Hyper-V as plug and play.

I do not really see the point (for most users) of ensuring Hyper-V can handle advanced Linux requirements.
Blaming MS for inability to do such advanced features is rather a waste of time - MS have got far more important things to do rather than divert resources to such handling features that do not benefit Windows.

In the end, it is simply easier to native boot Linux distros.

I just install them on a separate drive and select EFI from bios to run them rather than trying to shoehorn them into Windows boot manager or use alternative boot managers such as grub.

cereberus said:

What is more fundamental than no sound (no vision I suppose lol)?

All these other aspects, such as lack of usb support in basic mode can be got around by copying usb contents to onedrive or a virtual hard drive.

You should look at things from a Windows perspective - most people running Linux distros in Hyper-v just want to load one up in Hyper-V as plug and play.

I do not really see the point (for most users) of ensuring Hyper-V can handle advanced Linux requirements.
Blaming MS for inability to do such advanced features is rather a waste of time - MS have got far more important things to do rather than divert resources to such handling features that do not benefit Windows.

In the end, it is simply easier to native boot Linux distros.

I just install them on a separate drive and select EFI from bios to run them rather than trying to shoehorn them into Windows boot manager or use alternative boot managers such as grub.

Click to expand...

Again depends on what you want - plenty of people use a VM as a server - in fact I think not that long ago you were quite keen on the idea !! - and a server doesn't need to have most of the facilities a full desktop or worktation needs - a Linux server can handle multiple file systems, is multi (concurrent) user so is ideally suited to handlling a load of clients (Windows, Macs, Linux etc) for backups, multi-media file serving etc etc.

I agree if you want a full desktop GUI for Linux -- then just boot it !!! - but the "Sound" issue is not really really relevant for loads of people-- I'd think in any case that could easily be accomplished if Hyper-V allowed some sort of USB or even PCI re-direct and dynamic re-connection. Connecting non Disk type USB devices to a HYPER-V VM system -- e.g a video cam is still not on !!!!

Without decent hardware "re-directs" then for typical home users - HYPER-V doesn't make a lot of sense no matter how good it is - these users should stick to VBOX or VmWare.

In fact for testing FULL facilities with different Windows releases using things like docker containers could be a much better way now in any case rather than using VM's at all.


Cheers
jimbo