App & Browser control section is completely missing from windows security center

fg2001gf11F · Oct 17, 2022

dujd said:
Mi Windows Upate does not detect version 1.2209. The official version I have is 1.2207. I got this version after updating Windows to 22H2, but due to problems with the leftover after the old update I was forced to install version 1.2109. And that was my mistake, because it was enough to delete the folder in system32 \ SecurityHealth. But it turns out that version 1.2207 is the last stable version of the application. I discovered it thanks to you and I am grateful for your help

I think MS keeps screwing up mixing the version of the Windows Security Apllication Versions.
After a clean install and checking for updates, I am now at 22621.674 and the SecHealthUI is still 1000.22621.1.0.
It did not find any new updates for the Security platform. The folder C:\Windows\System32\SecurityHealth is still empty.
The version of SecHealthUI is still the same as right after the clean install.

Microsoft.SecHealthUI Microsoft.SecHealthUI_1000.22621.1.0_x64__8wekyb3d8bbwe

The other machines that were updated from previous 21H2 Build to 22H2 now show this:

Microsoft.SecHealthUI Microsoft.SecHealthUI_1000.25183.1000.0_x64__8wekyb3d8bbwe

dujd · Oct 17, 2022

That's why I'm surprised where you got version 1.2209, since the official version of the 22H2 system is 1.2207. After a clean installation, version 1.2207 is also received, and Windows Update does not find a newer one.

fg2001gf11F · Oct 17, 2022

dujd said:
That's why I'm surprised where you got version 1.2209, since the official version of the 22H2 system is 1.2207. After a clean installation, version 1.2207 is also received, and Windows Update does not find a newer one.

I don't get any updates of Windows Security App after a clean install. not 2207 nor 2209.

On previous updated builds it just came down with Windows Update like the other ones 2109, 2207 and then 2209.
But on a Clean install of 22621.525 and updated to 22621.674 none of those updates were offered and the folder SecurityHealth is still empty.

This version that was there on clean install did not change at all after checking for updates, it is still the same.

Microsoft.SecHealthUI Microsoft.SecHealthUI_1000.22621.1.0_x64__8wekyb3d8bbwe

Looks like a big typical MS mess.

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fg2001gf11F · Oct 17, 2022

dujd said:
That's why I'm surprised where you got version 1.2209, since the official version of the 22H2 system is 1.2207. After a clean installation, version 1.2207 is also received, and Windows Update does not find a newer one.

This one is on the Beta Build 22623.746. It also got 2208.

And this one in Release Preview channel has all 4.

fg2001gf11F · Oct 17, 2022

@Bree,
I found a way around the missing "Smart App Control" and got it to show up where it was missing before.
Just by hiding the folders with the security updated versions in SecurityHealth.
(Renaming by adding _old or deleting them with rmdir /s).
Also, I had to hide (or delete) the SecurityHealthSetup.exe, otherwise it will recreate the folder with the latest updates 1.0.2209.22001-0.

Edition Windows 11 Pro
Version 22H2
Installed on ‎9/‎27/‎2022
OS build 22621.675
Experience Windows Feature Experience Pack 1000.22634.1000.0

After doing that, the security "About" does not show the Windows Security Service Version: 1.0.2209.22001-0 anymore and the behavior of the security Smart App Control changes and it now shows up on the screen, but clearly it also shows that it is off because this was not a clean install.

So, the whole experiment seems pretty useless other that showing what changes the behavior of this specific item.

It now behaves in a similar way like with Dev Build 25217.
Still, it looks pretty messy and confusing the way MS is updating this Security Application and Service.
There must be a better way of doing it without making it so inconsistent from one build to the next.

Smart App Control Frequently Asked Questions - Microsoft Support

Frequently asked questions (FAQs) about Smart App Control, a Windows feature designed to block malicious, untrusted, or potentially unwanted apps from running on your device.

support.microsoft.com

Important: Smart App Control can be used on new Windows 11 installs only. If you received it as part of a Windows update on an already running device, you won't be able to turn it on unless you reset your PC or re-install Windows.

fg2001gf11F · Oct 17, 2022

dujd said:
That's why I'm surprised where you got version 1.2209, since the official version of the 22H2 system is 1.2207. After a clean installation, version 1.2207 is also received, and Windows Update does not find a newer one.

You should read this and forget about Smart App Control, unless you are doing a clean install.

:

Smart App Control Frequently Asked Questions - Microsoft Support

Frequently asked questions (FAQs) about Smart App Control, a Windows feature designed to block malicious, untrusted, or potentially unwanted apps from running on your device.

support.microsoft.com

Important: Smart App Control can be used on new Windows 11 installs only. If you received it as part of a Windows update on an already running device, you won't be able to turn it on unless you reset your PC or re-install Windows.

BrianInEngland · Oct 18, 2022

dujd said:
but you can access via search by typing Smart App Control. The options are then displayed but cannot be set. The latest stable version is 1.2207 and it was sent to me by a friend whom I sent after accidentally uploading 1.2109. Everything works for me now, but I don't want to mess with unknown versions.

I think MS sent the wrong security version updates to non-Dev builds

Bree said:
Interesting. For the three examples I gave in post #93 only the first one that does show Smart App Control was version 1000.22621.1.0.

View attachment 42621

Both the others (no Smart App Control showing) were version 1000.25183.0.1000, which BTW is also shown in About for Windows Security.

View attachment 42622

Thank you, both my machines that have version 1000.25183.0.1000 show the Smart App Control when I search for it. None of the options, On, Evaluation, or Off, are selected, but all can be clicked on and will trigger the UAC prompt. But as you say, even if you click 'Yes' nothing changes.

View attachment 42628

Yes, you'll also notice that on the 25183 version, the version number is displayed in the About box, but not in the 22621 version. Would deleting the 1.0.2209.22001-0 folder be safe? Would I still have security working properly without this folder? It's interesting that this is no longer offered on any build (RP/Beta or even Dev). I'm still convinced MS sent the updates out by mistake

fg2001gf11F · Oct 18, 2022

BrianInEngland said:
I think MS sent the wrong security version updates to non-Dev builds

Yes, you'll also notice that on the 25183 version, the version number is displayed in the About box, but not in the 22621 version. Would deleting the 1.0.2209.22001-0 folder be safe? Would I still have security working properly without this folder? It's interesting that this is no longer offered on any build (RP/Beta or even Dev). I'm still convinced MS sent the updates out by mistake

@BrianInEngland,
See my previous 2 posts. I managed to get the Smart App Control with version 1000.25183.0.1000, hiding the stuff in SecurityHealth folder.
Still the Security updates they send out don't seem to be compatible with all Windows Builds, but apparently MS thinks they should work for all Builds, which clearly it is not the case. It is a big mess that started with 22000.xxxx and now 22621.xxx and 22623.xxx

Last security update was 2209, soon we'll see 2210 with some new bugs.

Just rename the folders instead of deleting so you can always go back. The problem is that you also need to hide the SecurityHealthSetup.exe or it will recreate the folder for the last update 2209.

I'm going to bad, catch you later.

Bree · Oct 18, 2022

For your information, I have just had to do a clean install of the Dev build 25217.1010 in a supported VM. Smart App Control was on an in Evaluation mode by default.

BrianInEngland · Oct 18, 2022

Bree said:
For your information, I have just had to do a clean install of the Dev build 25217.1010 in a supported VM. Smart App Control was on an in Evaluation mode by default.

View attachment 42666 View attachment 42665

I'm not too worried about SAC but it's meant to be there, part of 22H2. It's the fact that the

Bree said:
For your information, I have just had to do a clean install of the Dev build 25217.1010 in a supported VM. Smart App Control was on an in Evaluation mode by default.

View attachment 42666 View attachment 42665

You have a very old version of the AM Client, 4.18.2209.7 is the newest. Looks to me like I don't 'need' the 1.0.2209.22001-0 folder.

BrianInEngland · Oct 18, 2022

This is so weird! Pic 1 is the version of systemhealthsystray.exe that's actually running, Pic 2 is the version that's in the 1.0.2209.22001 folder. I don't think the folder actually serves any useful purpose!

fg2001gf11F · Oct 18, 2022

Bree said:
For your information, I have just had to do a clean install of the Dev build 25217.1010 in a supported VM. Smart App Control was on an in Evaluation mode by default.

Yes thanks.
I had to do the same clean install for 22621.675 to get the Smart App Control enabled in evaluation mode.
Also, SecurityHealth folder did not have any update, it was empty.

BrianInEngland · Oct 18, 2022

fg2001gf11F said:
Yes thanks.
I had to do the same clean install for 22621.675 to get the Smart App Control enabled in evaluation mode.
Also, SecurityHealth folder did not have any update, it was empty.

Yes I think the updates sent out in Aug/Sept were for the wrong versions of Security and/or Windows. If they were necessary updates then they'd re-install after a clean install.

fg2001gf11F · Oct 18, 2022

BrianInEngland said:
Yes I think the updates sent out in Aug/Sept were for the wrong versions of Security and/or Windows. If they were necessary updates then they'd re-install after a clean install.

I had an FBH report on the subject.

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fg2001gf11F · Oct 19, 2022

BrianInEngland said:
Yes, I think the updates sent out in Aug/Sept were for the wrong versions of Security and/or Windows. If they were necessary updates then they'd re-install after a clean install.

I'm trying yet another experiment, starting from 22000.1163, after I delete all the stuff in the SecurityHealth folder.
I'll then let W.U. upgrade to 22621.675 and see if there will be any updates to Windows Security at all after that or if it will stay with the version of 22621.
I'll get back with the results after it is done.

fg2001gf11F · Oct 19, 2022

BrianInEngland said:
Yes I think the updates sent out in Aug/Sept were for the wrong versions of Security and/or Windows. If they were necessary updates then they'd re-install after a clean install.

As I expected after letting W.U. upgrade from 22000.1163 to 22621.675 as I explained earlier, I now I have Smart App Control showing up correctly in the App and Browser Control screen.
The SecurityHealth folder is still empty, and no weird security updates have been installed yet, see third screenshot below. This is the version of the SecHealthUI installed 1000.22621.1.0_x64

Microsoft.SecHealthUI Microsoft.SecHealthUI_1000.22621.1.0_x64__8wekyb3d8bbwe

Everything looks now normal as I expected.
Clearly, it shows that Smart App Control it is Off because this was not a clean install, but at least it is now showing it correctly.

W.U. is no longer downloading the Security updates that were causing the problems.

I checked for updates multiple times and did not find anything for security.

BrianInEngland · Oct 19, 2022

fg2001gf11F said:
As I expected after letting W.U. upgrade from 22000.1163 to 22621.675 as I explained earlier, I now I have Smart App Control showing up correctly in the App and Browser Control screen.
The SecurityHealth folder is still empty, and no weird security updates have been installed yet, see third screenshot below. This is the version of the SecHealthUI installed 1000.22621.1.0_x64

Microsoft.SecHealthUI Microsoft.SecHealthUI_1000.22621.1.0_x64__8wekyb3d8bbwe

Everything looks now normal as I expected.
Clearly, it shows that Smart App Control it is Off because this was not a clean install, but at least it is now showing it correctly.

View attachment 42743
View attachment 42744

View attachment 42745

View attachment 42746

Yes it's clear that the 25183 Security updates were not intended for non-Dev builds. Question is now, how do I get 22621 version back? Resetting the security app only re-installs the same version.

fg2001gf11F · Oct 19, 2022

BrianInEngland said:
Yes it's clear that the 25183 Security updates were not intended for non-Dev builds. Question is now, how do I get 22621 version back? Resetting the security app only re-installs the same version.

I just fixed another machine using the .appx in folder 2207 which is for 22621.
I then deleted everything in the SecurityHealth folder and that did the trick.
I assume you could leave the 2207 folder and delete everything else including the SecurityHealtSetup.exe which would recreate the 2209 folder.

This is the .appx in the 2207 folder and it is the right one for Build 22621 (22H2) I used it to reinstall the correct version.

Then I used "rmdir /s foldername" to remove the other folders from cmd prompt in recovery mode and "del SecurityHealthSetup.exe"
Or you can copy the 2207 folder on a different drive so that you can reuse it as needed.

BrianInEngland · Oct 19, 2022

fg2001gf11F said:
I just fixed another machine using the .appx in folder 2207 which is for 22621.
I then deleted everything in the SecurityHealth folder and that did the trick.
I assume you could leave the 2207 folder and delete everything else including the SecurityHealtSetup.exe which would recreate the 2209 folder.

This is the .appx in the 2207 folder and it is the right one for Build 22621 (22H2) I used it to reinstall the correct version.
Then I used "rmdir /s foldername" to remove the other folders from cmd prompt in recovery mode and "del SecurityHealthSetup.exe"
Or you can copy the 2207 folder on a different drive so that you can reuse it as needed.
View attachment 42751

Thanks, I think the other PC here has the 2207 folder so I'll get it from there

I've already used Recovery to delete folders in the SecurityHealth folder

fg2001gf11F · Oct 19, 2022

BrianInEngland said:
Thanks, I think the other PC here has the 2207 folder so I'll get it from there I've already used Recovery to delete folders in the SecurityHealth folder

I just fixed the 3rd machine the same way.

It also works with the 25183 version, if the folder 2209 and the setup.exe are removed.

App & Browser control section is completely missing from windows security center

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