Solved Switch to Linux

I'm getting a bit sick of this thread - there's either users doing things 99% of most people using machines who would never have heard of doing some of the really complex specialized stuff mentioned in this thread much less trying to do them or just totally incorrect factual information - I think those users know who they are !!.

I've used Linux (and Windows) for over 20 Years and nether OS in the past has been without problems -- I remember in particular how Windows NT was an absolute dog to get anything to run on it at all without a great deal of work and Networking was a major exercise in frustration. I started back then with CENTOS Linux (by RED HAT) and it worked even then straight OOTB.

Drivers aren't a problem any more with Linux unless you have convoluted hardware (even Nvidia stuff on the whole). Windows these days have more issues with "Driver signing etc",/

I've found anything I need to do on a computer can be covered around 90% in Linux and 10% in Windows -- so I use both. Nothing wrong in using multiple OS'es -- It's also the best way IMO to escape from the inevitable increasing "Subscription traps too.

Some test users I've tried with a properly configured Linux workspace have had no problems doing what they have to do - and doing it just as the would do on Windows. And of course if you want to stick with Windows legacy applications there's always the possibility of using Virtual Machines which run at near native speeds on KVM/QEMU if you set it up right.

'Nuf said on this

Cheers
jimbo

I find it mildly amusing that this thread has gone full circle several times. I guess that's why it's 14 pages. All I will say is I am perfectly familiar and comfortable in both windows as well as linux and can easily use either when the need be. I don't need "someones approval" and if that outrages anyone - too bad.

As you said, they can do their job IF Linux is set right. Who is going to setup it right? The same users that struggle with Windows? What if they want to do something more? They will probably ask an experienced friend or professional service. The same experienced friend or professional can bypass compatibility check for them and install Windows 11, debloat it, make it lighter and give a few years more life to their old PC without sacrifice their convenience, without having to learn new things, new difficult things.

Silvio said:

No Linux drivers for your hardware peripheral,
You have to compile the driver for your hardware but build fails for your distro/gcc/kernel version
You cannot install your nvidia gfx driver, with secure boot enabled, you need to sign driver,
Software you need is on Mac/Windows only
You are subscribed to AV supplier, but no version available for Linux
Version of Citrix available for Linux, is not compatible with version of Citrix at work

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A couple of fair points there. Driver/Kernel signing is much better now. I'm not sure about nVidia, but Radeon works fine. Still some way to go though. Secure Boot is only an issue if you dual boot. It's an MS technology and requires MS to sign your files.

colinp said:

I am perfectly familiar and comfortable in both windows as well as linux and can easily use either when the need be.

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Same here. I don't really care which one I use except for certain tasks/apps that run better on either, then I prefer the better experience. One x sample that comes into mind is working in Android Studio which is miles faster on Linux. The experience is horrible on Windows. Not sure why, but it is what it is...

SlicEnDicE said:

A couple of fair points there. Driver/Kernel signing is much better now. I'm not sure about nVidia, but Radeon works fine. Still some way to go though. Secure Boot is only an issue if you dual boot. It's an MS technology and requires MS to sign your files.

Click to expand...

Even a fully rounded Linux dude, will have struggles usng Linux for everything, so a Windows dude switching to Linux, can forget it.

I remember years ago, using Libreoffice on Linux, and it worked great, but when I was sending CVs/Docs to agents, they would request docs authored in MSOffice, as the formatting/fonts would often be screwed, When opened in Word/Excel.

Using Windows VM running "proper" MS Office, cured all ot that mess.

Silvio said:

Even a fully rounded Linux dude, will have struggles usng Linux for everything, so a Windows dude switching to Linux, can forget it.

I remember years ago, using Libreoffice on Linux, and it worked great, but when I was sending CVs/Docs to agents, they would request docs authored in MSOffice, as the formatting/fonts would often be screwed, When opened in Word/Excel.

Using Windows VM running "proper" MS Office, cured all ot that mess.

Click to expand...

I remember using Open Office on Windows in order to avoid buying a license for the particular computer. If the document had any colors, or even worse some images, all were screwed when opening it in Microsoft Office on another computer. The reverse also was true. So you either have Microsoft Office everywhere or Open Office everywhere, you can't mix them. So to be on the safe side you either install some old probably unsupported Microsoft Office version on Linux using Wine or you stick with Windows, if you want to share your documents with others. And this is only one example of Linux incompatibility.

spapakons said:

I remember using Open Office on Windows in order to avoid buying a license for the particular computer. If the document had any colors, or even worse some images, all were screwed when opening it in Microsoft Office on another computer. The reverse also was true. So you either have Microsoft Office everywhere or Open Office everywhere, you can't mix them. So to be on the safe side you either install some old probably unsupported Microsoft Office version on Linux using Wine or you stick with Windows, if you want to share your documents with others. And this is only one example of Linux incompatibility.

Click to expand...

There's some free office software out here now which apart from running macros is pretty identical to Ms Office (and run both on Linux and Office).

I'll bet few have heard of this one but it's actually very good indeed.


Note there IS a free version.


You'll get the usual rubbishy remarks -- Don't trust software from China / Taiwan etc) -- why not -- most Chinese people (at least the ones I've met and been many times to Shanghai etc) are interested in doing decent business and making money. Getting involved in politics is the last thging they are bothered about.

For an email client Thunderbird is pretty good too -- that's easy enough to use if you haven't got Ms Office - also runs both on Linux and Windows.

I think its about time that we all wrapped this thread up.

Cheers
jimbo

Yes, we better help posters solve their issues than trying to warn others to think twice before switching to Linux. If they do this in a rush they will regret it. All of you that are today comfortable with Linux, how was your very first experience? If you say perfect and without difficulties you are definitely lying. You get the point.

spapakons said:

Yes, we better help posters solve their issues than trying to warn others to think twice before switching to Linux. If they do this in a rush they will regret it. All of you that are today comfortable with Linux, how was your very first experience? If you say perfect and without difficulties you are definitely lying. You get the point.

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It was horrible but so was Windows too. At least on Linux, once I got it working, it worked great, and never had to do it again. While Windows was fairly easy to setup, it was always broken. I even remembered mine and about 20 other friends CD keys in my sleep back then because I had to reinstall if not weekly, at least monthly.

Apart from automatic updates since Windows 10, Windows usually breaks when you try new things and not sure what you are doing. But trying to fix it builds your experience. Many of us can help others in this and other forums because we have already dealt with the same issues and know how to fix them. That said, Windows don't crash all the time as you claim, not even Windows 98 had too many BSOD as many claim.

spapakons said:

That said, Windows don't crash all the time as you claim, not even Windows 98 had too many BSOD as many claim.

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You are assuming things now, I never mentioned any crashes.

So what did you mean with "always broken" and that you had to reinstall too frequently? Probably you or your friends did something wrong and crashed. Other Windows users didn't have too many crashes. I have seen many old computers that still have their factory installed Windows after too many years.

Winuser said:

I think that when I was using Madrake Linux, the only printers I could find drivers for was the Lexmark printers. That was back in the days before Windows 7.

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If you check most of his posts in this topic - he's either flaming or spewing half-backed nonsense (as if talking about some ancient version of Linux from the 20 years ago - it just doesn't make any sense for modern/present desktop distributions). Based on same posts - he tried some distribution around 15 years ago (back with Windows 7) - and struggled to install the Wi-Fi drivers - while using the terminal, and... hated every Linux distro ever since? Doesn't sound plausible (to me at least), that incident alone - doesn't explain such a high level of loathing for the Linux Kernel.... And that's just it - even someone who started trying it yesterday - would use the name of the Distribution (Mint, Manjaro, Arch, Debian, OpenSUSE, Fedora, Ubuntu, Kubuntu, Lubuntu, etc) while describing its experience and such. Nobody says "Linux" - since even while using the same Kernel - the differences (way of doing things) - can be quite huge from one distro to another (worlds apart even - as if using a different Operating Sytem). Even more than that - if you've tried different distributions - you can notice even a clear division between the user of one distro an another (Arch being the most infamous in this regard).

Quite baffling how the least educated people on a subject - find so much negative energy - to spread piles upon piles of nonsense about it. Another repetitive/noticeable detail in same posts - even the idea of recommending Linux ( the Kernel... ) - triggers aggressive/negative reactions - as if all Hell would break loose for anyone who's not a Linux Expert (if someone is/was that skilled - while dabbling with the Linux Kernel itself.... this are people who can build their own Linux Distribution from scratch) or Enthusiasts (there's nothing enthusiastic about the Linux Kernel, or at least... if Linux meant just the Kernel - and i would have to build my own OS starting from that... i'd stick to using only Windows - and i presume it's same for the majority).

If anything, in 2024 only people with very specific software/hardware needs - might still struggle with any of the 100+ available Linux Distributions. I'm talking bleeding edge tech - where even the drivers for Windows are far from being mature. Or specific software - made only for Windows (and/or OSX). Software with a catch... as it's the case with Online Games - using Kernel-Level Anti-cheat. Same can be said about apps made by Adobe - where it's not the core software that's problematic to run (compatibility layers like Wine - helped a lot in this regard: support for Windows software) - but Ecosystems like Adobe Creative Cloud. There's plenty of beginner friendly Linux distributions. I revived/revitalized old laptops - using Linux Mint (mainly cause of LTS - but also a cleaner flavor of Ubuntu) - which were meant for aunties (60+) and children - who couldn't care less about the OS - it's all the same for them (a Computer). And no complaints so far (and some of this people "even have a thing for complaining - about anything"). It's actually Windows - which gave me many many head-aches - when same people were using it. (:

Not a rant, just a comment. I've been using Linux Mint on a Desktop, Intel Core i7-4770 Gigabyte motherboard, and a Dell Inspiron 15 Notebook. Started several years ago, at least with version 13 and now on 22. It allows me to a couple of things that Windows won't, I have no money in the Intel and the Dell I bought about 12 years ago, won't run Win11 even with the tweaks as it doesn't have the required SSE 4.2 so I repurposed it instead of putting in landfill. I also try different versions of Linux bootable LiveUSB to get a better idea of what is available and what I might like as to appearance. Bottom line? It's all about what the User wants to do and the machinery required to efficiently do it. I used to drive GM vehicles, now have Toyota, the jobs get done.

With enough determination Linux can run on anything.....

@neves Very well said. Amen!

Linux Mint works really well for me on this device, except for my fingerprint reader which I don't use on Windows either. It is very unreliable.

spapakons said:

Yes, we better help posters solve their issues than trying to warn others to think twice before switching to Linux. If they do this in a rush they will regret it. All of you that are today comfortable with Linux, how was your very first experience? If you say perfect and without difficulties you are definitely lying. You get the point.

Click to expand...

Well my first experience with Windows, was Windows 2 and it wasn't exactly 100% straight-forward. Any of us who gamed with DOS back in the day remembers trying to free memory using autoexec.bat and config.sys

My first experience with Linux was about 25 years ago, around 1998. My wife was gone for the weekend, and I bought a big 800 page Que manual for Calera open linux and I started reading and installing it on some old machines I had lying around. Probably took a solid year or so of playing with Linux back then to get comfortable with it.

spapakons said:

Apart from automatic updates since Windows 10, Windows usually breaks when you try new things and not sure what you are doing. But trying to fix it builds your experience. Many of us can help others in this and other forums because we have already dealt with the same issues and know how to fix them. That said, Windows don't crash all the time as you claim, not even Windows 98 had too many BSOD as many claim.

Click to expand...

How are you aware of how much Windows 98 crashed for some people back in the day? Windows 10 and 11 has rarely every crashed on me. My primary desktop has had 2 blue screens in 4 years. But I did have more problems back in the 95/98/SE/XP/2000/ days. Of course, I also had cheaper and crappier hardware back then. I also used to build new machines with these cheap parts about every 2 years because stuff changed so much, so fast. I used to use really questionably sourced software from sketchy websites. So, cheaper builds, frequently changed with crappier software = more crashes.

These days, things are changing way slower. My primary desktop is a Ryzen 9 5900x, an Nvidia 3080, 64GB of RAM and terrabytes of SSD and NVMe storage space. It's build with more expensive and established parts It's 4 years old...but it's still super fast and I see no reason to replace it. It happens to still be on Windows 10 as it's been stable as can be, and I see no advantages for what I do with the machine to be on Windows 11.