Windows Networking Rant

antspants · Aug 24, 2023

johnlgalt said:
It works as it is supposed to - until something else comes along and breaks it.

Something certainly breaks something. Imagine my frustrations, two fresh installs of Windows, one on PC one on laptop (have also tried this with two other PC’s on the network) no updates, no software… can’t even see other computers in the file explorer network. Just printer and router.

antspants · Aug 24, 2023

MisterEd said:
I open that folder and create a shortcut to each computer in my network. For example, the shortcut to computer DarkMatter is \\DarkMattter.

Holly crap & what the hell. How easy was that!

What a legend.

johnlgalt · Aug 24, 2023

But you realize, now, that your computers *can* actually see each other. MisterEd's methods show that networking in and of itself is not actually broken - and you now see it too.

antspants · Aug 24, 2023

johnlgalt said:
But you realize, now, that your computers *can* actually see each other. MisterEd's methods show that networking in and of itself is not actually broken - and you now see it too.

Yes.

Winuser · Aug 24, 2023

@MisterEd Using my wife's laptop as an example. When she is using it, it normally shows under Network. Right now she is on her laptop and it's not showing. She is playing a game online so it is on the network. I'm glad it always works for you but for some of us it's either hit or miss. Networking on Windows still needs a lot of work. What prompted me to start this thread was the fact that I got a error about Network Discovery and File Sharing being off. How the heck could they be off if I was already connected to the mini PC?

Winuser · Aug 24, 2023

johnlgalt said:
But you realize, now, that your computers *can* actually see each other. MisterEd's methods show that networking in and of itself is not actually broken - and you now see it too.

Local networking may not be broken but it sure has a lot of bugs. Like I just posted, my wifes laptop is not showing up and it normally does.

johnlgalt · Aug 24, 2023

It seemingly has a lot of bugs because of other stuff. The networking works until other stuff gets in the way.

These are Windows bugs. The Server equivalents of Windows Desktop OSs don't have these bugs - and coincidentally, they also don't have a lot of these "help the user do things easier" features baked into them either.

Winuser · Aug 24, 2023

johnlgalt said:
It seemingly has a lot of bugs because of other stuff. The networking works until other stuff gets in the way.

My opinion is it's because MS either has no clue on how or the desire to fix the problem. As for stuff, It works when it wants and doesn't work when it doesn't want to work. With nothing changing, What is this stuff?

johnlgalt · Aug 24, 2023

My experience is if you take all the crap out of Windows that gets in the way, including 'helpful' power plans, fast switching, fast startup, etc. and run with a clean system it works as intended.

Because the stuff they have for making people's lives still changes things in the background. Like shutting off LAN connections when not in use 'to save power'. If that is enabled, it is a change inflicted upon the system even though the end user doesn't perceive anything as changing.

Windows 10 and especially 11 go even further. When your wife is playing the game, perhaps Windows is locking out connections incoming so her, as the primary, locally logged in user, won't be disrupted by an incoming connection from another source.

Windows 11 supports HDR, and I have it on all the time - but it tries to be helpful by enabling that HDR even in games that don't support it, making them look washed out and overly bright.

Trust me, even if you think nothing has changed, something has.

MisterEd · Aug 24, 2023

Winuser said:
@MisterEd Using my wife's laptop as an example. When she is using it, it normally shows under Network. Right now she is on her laptop and it's not showing. She is playing a game online so it is on the network. I'm glad it always works for you but for some of us it's either hit or miss. Networking on Windows still needs a lot of work. What prompted me to start this thread was the fact that I got a error about Network Discovery and File Sharing being off. How the heck could they be off if I was already connected to the mini PC?

For some reason once in a while on some computers I also get the message Network Discovery not turned on. I just click on it and go on.

Out of curiosity sometimes I check File Explorer/Network and see that some of my computers do show up. The problem is that is not always true. For that reason I use the network computer shortcuts. They always work.

I would like to add this comment. I have been following threads like this on this and other forums for years. Conventional wisdom is to tell people to follow some tutorial or checklist which is supposed to solve the problem. At best these only provide temporary fixes. I got tired of constantly fighting network problems. That is why I use the network computer shortcut method. It is simple to use and always works. My stress levels are much lower because of that.

johnlgalt · Aug 25, 2023

MisterEd said:
Out of curiosity sometimes I check File Explorer/Network and see that some of my computers do show up. The problem is that is not always true. For that reason I use the network computer shortcuts. They always work.

Bingo. And since they always work, that means the networking always works.

You cut out all the mess that Windows does to try to be 'helpful' to you and go the direct route. I, for one, am not surprised that it works. I suspect you're not surprised by it either.

Fabler2 · Aug 25, 2023

johnlgalt said:
Bingo. And since they always work, that means the networking always works.

You cut out all the mess that Windows does to try to be 'helpful' to you and go the direct route. I, for one, am not surprised that it works. I suspect you're not surprised by it either.

This is interesting. I've a USB drive connected with my router so created a shortcut for-\\Archer_VR900\volume(sda2)- which worked yesterday. Today it failed with an error not finding (Z). So had to go to File Explorer and disconnect and Map it again. It happens once in a while anyway.

johnlgalt · Aug 25, 2023

Fabler2 said:
This is interesting. I've a USB drive connected with my router so created a shortcut for-\\Archer_VR900\volume(sda2)- which worked yesterday. Today it failed with an error not finding (Z). So had to go to File Explorer and disconnect and Map it again. It happens once in a while anyway.

Check and see if Windows is set to disconnect USB devices 'to save energy' (on the Power Management tab in Device Manager) - If it does that it would probably cause the drive to no longer be accessible.

The trick is if you want only that one device to not have power saving features enabled. You have to unplug the device, open Device Manager, expand the USB section, then plug the device in and find the new device that just got added in that section.

For example, this device has power management disabled, and thus won't ever 'disappear' from Explorer because the system felt the need to save me a few pennies.

Not all devices will have a Power Management tab, though.

This is an example of a USB-attached device that does not have that PM tab:

And then it is a bit more tricky, because your USB ports can also be a part of a USB hub, and those almost always have that PM tab:

But the real trick is figuring out which is more important in the long run - energy savings, or convenience of having drives always available.

Fabler2 · Aug 25, 2023

I don't know if the router has that ability. However I've now also created a network location as well to see if that helps.
This is what shows in 'Network',

and in File explorer,

johnlgalt · Aug 25, 2023

Whoops. My bad, you're right, the router probably doesn't have that ability. I was thinking connected to the computer.

If the router was disconnected even temporarily (or your computer was disconnected from it, to be more accurate), this might have happened.

Fabler2 · Aug 25, 2023

johnlgalt said:
Whoops. My bad, you're right, the router probably doesn't have that ability. I was thinking connected to the computer.

If the router was disconnected even temporarily (or your computer was disconnected from it, to be more accurate), this might have happened.

I just think it's Winders having an 'age-thing' and is easily confused......

johnlgalt · Aug 25, 2023

Or as I say, it confrused itself.

:ROFLMAO:

Winuser · Aug 27, 2023

I have another problem to complain about that I had almost forgot about. My computers Wi-Fi will randomly switch from being directly connected to my Comcast router and connect to the Wi-Fi extender. I had this problem happen awhile ago when I was using a Rockspace extender. No matter what I tried the Wi-Fi would switch for no known reason to me. I was told by some that it shouldn't happen but I know for a fact that it does. Now it's starting to happen with the new extender I have. I have never manually connected to the extender so I have no clue as to why or how the desktop was able to connect without me entering the password. I was wondering why my transfer speeds were about half of what I usually get and when I checked I found I was on the extender. I wouldn't really care except for the faster transfer speeds over Wi-Fi 6.

MisterEd · Aug 27, 2023

Winuser said:
I have another problem to complain about that I had almost forgot about. My computers Wi-Fi will randomly switch from being directly connected to my Comcast router and connect to the Wi-Fi extender. I had this problem happen awhile ago when I was using a Rockspace extender. No matter what I tried the Wi-Fi would switch for no known reason to me. I was told by some that it shouldn't happen but I know for a fact that it does. Now it's starting to happen with the new extender I have. I have never manually connected to the extender so I have no clue as to why or how the desktop was able to connect without me entering the password. I was wondering why my transfer speeds were about half of what I usually get and when I checked I found I was on the extender. I wouldn't really care except for the faster transfer speeds over Wi-Fi 6.

For reference:

Comcast XB8 Gateway
2.4GHz: 802.11 g/n/ax
5.0GHz: 802.11 a/n/ac/ax
6.0GHz: 802.11 ax

Wi-Fi 2: 802.11 a 5.0GHz
Wi-Fi 3: 802.11 g 2.4GHz
Wi-Fi 4: 802.11 n 5.0GHz
Wi-Fi 5: 802.11 ac 5.0GHz
Wi-Fi 6/6E: 802.11 ax 2.4,5.0,6.0 GHz

Are you connecting to both the Comcast router and the extender on the same band (i.e. 5.0GHz)? If so then the only thing I can see to do is get a 802.11 ax extender.

My problem was that sometimes my laptop would connect on the 2.4GHz band instead of the usual 5.0GHz band. I didn't realize that until I saw how slow it was. My solution was to set up different SSIDs for each band. I would set up my laptop to automatically connect to the 5.0GHz SSID. The 2.4GHz SSID was not an automatic connect.

antspants · Aug 27, 2023

MisterEd said:
. My solution was to set up different SSIDs for each band.

That’s what I had to do.

Windows Networking Rant

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