Windows XP?

shoober420 · Nov 7, 2024

cereberus said:
Huh - only reason for staying on XP is to run very old games. Only masochists would stay on it.

Try running MS Office since 2013.

I know for sure many of my works apps will not run on anything since Windows 8.

I love how people look at old OSs with rose coloured glasses conveniently forgetting how often they used to crash.

I remember XP crashing every day (BSOD equivalent).

Personally, I cannot remember last time W10/11 crashed with BSOD.

XP cannot run things like Hyper-V.

XP is simply not man enough to cope with modern systems.

No point in saying "ah but if..." as that is pure speculation.

In my opinion, XP should remain in dustbin of history, along with Vista, Windows 7/8.

Of course, nobody is stopping people using it but if they want to delude themselves XP is great, that is their prerogative.

I remember Windows 95/98 crashing alot, but not XP/7. I remember the opposite. XP and 7 were rock solid, and great operating systems. I stopped using Windows after 7 and went to Linux. I came back to Windows after my gf wanted me to build her machine for her. Windows 11 is bloat central, but im having so much fun de-bloating it and tweaking it with the knowledge i used to do back in Windows 7 days. Never used Hyper-V and disable all virtualization options (bloat).

spapakons · Nov 7, 2024

Catnip said:
XP was OK, I suppose. I preferred the look and feel of Windows 7, but I have grudgingly accepted the clunky, ugly GUI of Win 11 because it is more powerful. Or at least seems to be.

I have XP running on an old PC that I use for burning EPROMS and as a logic analyzer. Both programs for these things won't work on anything but XP no matter what compatibility setting I select, and they won't run from a VM as they require a hardware interface that can't be seen from within the VM.

So I guess I will have XP in my life for a while yet.

What virtual machine application did you try? VMWare Workstation can connect your parallel or serial ports to the guest. In fact I use a Windows XP virtual machine to connect my good old parallel Iomega ZIP drive. I had copied the Windows XP and XP x64 drivers and I could manually install them from Device Manager and use the drive up to Windows 7 32-bit/64-bit. Due to some change in the parallel port driver the drive is not detected in Windows 8 or higher. To properly detect the drive in Vista and 7 you have to enable legacy plug and play detection for the parallel port in Device Manager. Due to some unknown change in the parallel port driver in Windows 8 or higher the ZIP drive is not detected, even after enabling legacy plug and play support, hence the workaround using the XP virtual machine.

spapakons · Nov 7, 2024

shoober420 said:
I remember Windows 95/98 crashing alot, but not XP/7. I remember the opposite. XP and 7 were rock solid, and great operating systems. I stopped using Windows after 7 and went to Linux. I came back to Windows after my gf wanted me to build her machine for her. Windows 11 is bloat central, but im having so much fun de-bloating it and tweaking it with the knowledge i used to do back in Windows 7 days.

As with all Windows version, a BSOD is usually caused by some faulty driver or application or incorrect configuration. As long as you have installed the proper drivers you minimize the risk of experiencing a BSOD. That's why I prefer to download the official drivers from manufacturer and I don't trust Windows Update. Also the official drivers usually provide more features than just enabling the device.

spapakons · Nov 7, 2024

jimbo45 said:
Hi folks

Try this on a VM !!!

Windows XP Unofficial Service Pack 4 : harkaz : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

Windows XP official support has ended. Many users - including me - who won't be able to upgrade their old machines to a newer OS would like to easily install...

archive.org

cheers
jimbo

Already tried it, it is a collection of Windows XP updates (after SP3) in a single package. Since I wanted to have XP as more updated as possible, I installed it. This doesn't mean you can run any more applications than with SP3. Have in mind that it is not available in all languages. For example you cannot install it in Windows XP Greek, only in Windows XP EN-US.

shoober420 · Nov 7, 2024

spapakons said:
As with all Windows version, a BSOD is usually caused by some faulty driver or application or incorrect configuration. As long as you have installed the proper drivers you minimize the risk of experiencing a BSOD. That's why I prefer to download the official drivers from manufacturer and I don't trust Windows Update. Also the official drivers usually provide more features than just enabling the device.

for sure, i remember the classic bit with bill gates and that printer company guy and it BSOD during the demonstration. or how about this gem from south park

honestly though, win95/win98 is my favorite GUI, because vaporwave. XP/7 is cool with classic theme, but nothing beats 95/98 icons and the green background. i still use the green background to this day. im also a fan of this linix GTK theme

GitHub - grassmunk/Chicago95: A rendition of everyone's favorite 1995 Microsoft operating system for Linux.

A rendition of everyone's favorite 1995 Microsoft operating system for Linux. - GitHub - grassmunk/Chicago95: A rendition of everyone's favorite 1995 Microsoft operating system for Linux.

github.com

i really want to find a way to get those tile patterns back, like the brick and bubbles. oh man, im glad i lived in the golden age of computing as a kid

win98 also has unofficial sp

Windows 98, 98 SP1, 98 SE + ME Updates, Patches + (Hot)Fixes

MDGx AXCEL216 MAX Windows DOS 11 10 8.1 8 7 R2 2012 2008 Vista 2003 2K3 2000 2K XP SP1 SP2 SP3 Second Edition SE Millennium Edition ME 98 95 95a 95B 95C OSR2 OSR1 NT4 NT 3.11 3.1 3.10 3 DOS 6.22 6 tricks secrets tweaks tips hints hacks fixes updates upgrades bugs undocumented unofficial unique...

www.mdgx.com

spapakons · Nov 7, 2024

Yes, I liked the patterns too. The only way to use them today is to simulate them in an image and set it as wallpaper, but this has to be done for specific resolution. If the resolution is lower or higher and you stretch the wallpaper, the pattern would appear blur.

TIP: Just design the pattern once pixel-by-pixel and the copy it. Paste it carefully many times one next to the other to create a row. Then copy the row to paste it on a larger area and so on. Sure, it could take too much time to get it right, but I think it's worth it. If you only want the pattern without any image in the background, you could create a small image, say 100x100 pixels, set it as wallpaper and then select the Tile option, just make sure you create the image that way that if you tile it it appears seamless, as if it was a single large image.

TIP2: Even better, take a screenshot of the desired pattern in Windows 98, crop it to the appropriate size and then tile in in Windows 11.

jimbo45 · Nov 7, 2024

For XP the Lunar black theme was brilliant.

Cheers
jimbo

spapakons · Nov 7, 2024

jimbo45 said:
For XP the Lunar black theme was brilliant.

Cheers
jimbo

Lunar black? Sounds like the ugly Vista black taskbar. No thanks, I prefer color taskbar like in Windows 7 and higher.

shoober420 · Nov 7, 2024

i do like black themes and dark mode, but when it comes to windows, grey taskbar and dark blue titlebar is so iconic

Catnip · Nov 7, 2024

spapakons said:
What virtual machine application did you try? VMWare Workstation can connect your parallel or serial ports to the guest. In fact I use a Windows XP virtual machine to connect my good old parallel Iomega ZIP drive. I had copied the Windows XP and XP x64 drivers and I could manually install them from Device Manager and use the drive up to Windows 7 32-bit/64-bit. Due to some change in the parallel port driver the drive is not detected in Windows 8 or higher. To properly detect the drive in Vista and 7 you have to enable legacy plug and play detection for the parallel port in Device Manager. Due to some unknown change in the parallel port driver in Windows 8 or higher the ZIP drive is not detected, even after enabling legacy plug and play support, hence the workaround using the XP virtual machine.

I have tried a couple of VMs, but the hardware in use is so old that it plays tricks with the parallel port that newer versions of Windows (or VMs) can't seem to handle. Add to that, of of the pieces of hardware requires a PCI card inside the machine. Newer machines do not have the old PCI interface slots so I have to run it with an older PC that will barely run Win 7. Win 7 chokes on the control software for some reason, so my only option is XP.

I don't really mind XP in this case as I only use the system maybe once or twice a week. It's in the budget to replace the exotic hardware next year, and I am hoping for a USB solution when we do. Then I can use Win 10 or 11 and I may not have to have a dedicated PC for the task in the lab. If the new hardware is USB driven, we should just be able to plug in to our individual machines and all should be well.

At least, that is how I am hoping it will work. Time will tell.

Berton · Nov 7, 2024

Catnip said:
I have grudgingly accepted the clunky, ugly GUI of Win 11 because it is more powerful. Or at least seems to be.

Do keep in mind that the System Requirements increase with each release of the Operating System. Windows does perform better when those specs are met.

Catnip said:
Add to that, of of the pieces of hardware requires a PCI card inside the machine

My oldest Desktop is a Dell Inspiron 580 from 2009 running Win7, has a single PCI slot, 1 PCIe X16 slot, 2 PCIe X1 slots and USB ports. It has 4 SATA drive connections, no IDE/PATA socket. There is no 25-pin parallel port and no 9-pin male/9-pin female comm ports, I haven't worked on one older and none newer that had a PCI slot in quite awhile.

MisterEd · Nov 7, 2024

The biggest problem with Windows XP is that you have to activate it within 30 days with a valid key. If you don't you are not allowed to login anymore until you activate it.

I have two desktop computers that are running Windows XP Pro. Since phone activation doesn't work anymore I had to call Microsoft support and have an agent help me activate them. BTW, I have original XP Pro keys that I bought over twenty years ago. I also have an old laptop that came with Windows XP Tablet Edition.

Microsoft stated that Windows XP only required 256MB memory. I found out that 512MB memory was better. Most people didn't need more that that. However, some people with more demanding needs did benefit with more RAM.

Windows XP 32-bit probably met the need of probably 99.9% of users. Windows XP 64-bit was released for the small number of people that wanted it.

I was kind of crazy back in 2002 when I built my first computer with Windows XP. I paid $378 for two sticks of 512MB Corsair XMS RAM.

Windows XP retail (32-bit) editions

Windows XP Home Edition
Windows XP Professional Edition

Windows XP OEM only (32-bit) editions

Windows XP Media Center Edition
Windows XP Tablet PC Edition

Windows XP retail (64-bit) editions

Windows XP Professional x64 Edition

I have the original floppy disks for DOS 6.22 and Windows for Workgroups 3.11. I created floppy images of them. That is what I used to install DOS 6.22 and Windows FWG 3.11 on a VMware virtual machine.

spapakons · Nov 7, 2024

What if you use a USB to parallel port cable (not a USB to parallel printer port) and set it as LPT1 in Device Manager? I think most legacy applications fail because they expect a standard LPT1 at address 378 etc. I think you can change it from Device Manager to be LPT1. I know you can do that for USB to serial cables, you can change the port to COM1 for compatibility with legacy applications.

Berton · Nov 7, 2024

File Manager from Win3.1 as a portable/stand-alone app [drive Z: is a NAS attached to my LAN]:

spapakons · Nov 7, 2024

Regarding RAM, yes you could run Windows XP RTM and SP1/2 with 256MB RAM or even 128MB. The minimum requirement to allow upgrade from Windows 98 or NT 4.0 was 64MB and the absolute minimum was 32MB but extremely slow as you can imagine. Since SP3 running with 512MB is not enough and tests your patience. The more features you add to Windows the more RAM you need. 2GB is recommended to run comfortably without many delays.

MisterEd · Nov 7, 2024

It is hard to believe now but SATA HDDs did not exist when Windows XP was released in October 2001. In fact SATA HDDs were not for sale until some time in 2003.

My two old desktop computers had IDE HDDs until last year. Now they have SATA HDDs. They are SATA 1.0 which is 150Mbps. Not real fast but still noticeably faster than IDE. They trickiest part about using SATA HDDs with these old computers is that the BIOSs in 2002-2003 did not support SATA. When XP was set up I had to hit F6 to load the SATA drivers from a floppy disk.

Catnip · Nov 7, 2024

spapakons said:
What if you use a USB to parallel port cable (not a USB to parallel printer port) and set it as LPT1 in Device Manager? I think most legacy applications fail because they expect a standard LPT1 at address 378 etc. I think you can change it from Device Manager to be LPT1. I know you can do that for USB to serial cables, you can change the port to COM1 for compatibility with legacy applications.

If you were replying to me, I am afraid that a USB to parallel solution doesn't work. The program that I use employs some bit twiddling at the hardware level. I have tried a USB to parallel port cable with no success. I wish it had worked though. I could have dumped the old PC and used a new one.

Berton · Nov 7, 2024

There are LPT cards available, Amazon shows some for a PCIe slot:

Amazon.com : Parallel Port Cards

MisterEd · Nov 7, 2024

Catnip said:
If you were replying to me, I am afraid that a USB to parallel solution doesn't work. The program that I use employs some bit twiddling at the hardware level. I have tried a USB to parallel port cable with no success. I wish it had worked though. I could have dumped the old PC and used a new one.

I have a couple computers that I built between 2009 and 2013. They don't have a parallel port but do have serial ports. Would a serial to parallel port converter cable work in your application?

Farquard · Nov 7, 2024

Ghot said:
I still have my original retail copy of XP.

I have mine as well, and being sorta a pack rat, I also have DOS versions back to 1.0 all the way until they stopped offering DOS, and then all the versions of Windows from 1.0 (I have nothing left to run that) but I do have an old Dell 5000e that still runs Windows 3.11 just for some of those great games that drive my great great nieces and nephews nuts. As good as they are on the more modern games those they have trouble with.

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