System Disable Modern Standby in Windows 10 and Windows 11

Sorry Denis. I really appreciate your efforts but I ran out of time. Think it was you that suggested just set to never sleep (Windows definition of sleep) and that is what I did. Once set all the tasks started on schedule.

My position was and continues to be, modern standby, out of the box, no customizations should runs tasks as it did in S3. I realize for my Macrium I would have to enable network, another thing Windows should ask during setup.

Ken,

I agree with you.

Whilst S0 Modern standby is Intel's brainchild, MS & device manufacturers have taken it up with relish.
And they seem to have accepted without question the central falsehood that "The S3 power model is an older standard and is not capable of the instant on that consumers expect from modern devices." {see Modern Standby vs S3 - MSDocs}
I have never expected that.
And S0 Modern standby does not provide "instant on" anyway.

As for network connectivity during S0 Modern standby, I also agree with you there.

As I noted in those links I gave you before, discovering that setting Sleep after to Never allowed Task scheduler to do its job was a revelation to me.


All the best,
Denis

So I'm another member still struggling with Modern Standby.

I have it set to never sleep but it still manages to sleep, or nap. Backups don't run and when they do, over the network, it says it can't find the NAS. So I used the the tutorial to always enable the network in modern standby and it still occasional fails. I also had to shut off "Allow the computer to shutoff power to the bluetooth adapter" to get the mouse to run properly, it would just freeze and a reboot was required. My AV scans are also being missed.

Enough time wasted, decide to enable S3. Used this tutorial and entered the command to disable Modern Standby. Restart. Modern Standby disable but S3 not enable. Checked BIOS and the setting to block S3 is not enabled. ( This is a Dell XPS 9720 ). Dell tells me it supports S3. Before I call Dell does anyone know what I may have missed? Thanks.

Caledon Ken said:

So I'm another member still struggling with Modern Standby.

I have it set to never sleep but it still manages to sleep, or nap. Backups don't run and when they do, over the network, it says it can't find the NAS. So I used the the tutorial to always enable the network in modern standby and it still occasional fails. I also had to shut off "Allow the computer to shutoff power to the bluetooth adapter" to get the mouse to run properly, it would just freeze and a reboot was required. My AV scans are also being missed.

Enough time wasted, decide to enable S3. Used this tutorial and entered the command to disable Modern Standby. Restart. Modern Standby disable but S3 not enable. Checked BIOS and the setting to block S3 is not enabled. ( This is a Dell XPS 9720 ). Dell tells me it supports S3. Before I call Dell does anyone know what I may have missed? Thanks.

Click to expand...

Hello Ken,

What is your powercfg /a report showing for S3?

Not available. I should have taken picture. I set it back to laptop back to Modern Standby. Think it said firmware does not support. That didn't make much sense to me as Dell has the setting that says block S3. If firmware didn't support S3 you wouldn't need setting.

I went through the power settings in UEFI but saw nothing preventing S3.

Caledon Ken said:

Not available. I should have taken picture. I set it back to laptop back to Modern Standby. Think it said firmware does not support. That didn't make much sense to me as Dell has the setting that says block S3. If firmware didn't support S3 you wouldn't need setting.

I went through the power settings in UEFI but saw nothing preventing S3.

Click to expand...

You might check at Dell to see if they have a new firmware version for your specific model available that does support S3.

Thanks. I have checked pretty regularly but I will check again.

Boy I won't be happy after being told it does support S3 during the period that I could threaten them with returning it.

Ken

Caledon Ken said:

I have it set to never sleep but it still manages to sleep, or nap

Click to expand...

Your computer does not sleep. S0 Modern standby is not sleep.
- The point of "never sleep" is to avoid it going into a later phase of S0 Modern standby so that Task scheduler tasks can run.
- Without "never sleep", it would go into a later phase of S0 Modern standby & Task scheduler tasks would not run.

I do not know what problem is causing your tasks not to run at the moment. I do suspect undocumented power saving issues with your hardware.
I can only suggest that if any task scheduler tasks run then the failing tasks are failing because of specific facilities that they need such as the NAS you mentioned.

Caledon Ken said:

Modern Standby disable but S3 not enable. Checked BIOS and the setting to block S3 is not enabled. ( This is a Dell XPS 9720 ). Dell tells me it supports S3. Before I call Dell does anyone know what I may have missed?

Click to expand...

Disabling S0 Modern standby does not always enable S3 Sleep.
If your Bios has a relevant setting then I do wonder what it is supposed to do. If you had S0 Modern standby enabled and that setting was not made use of then it might not be quite what its name suggests.
And I do wonder what Event viewer can tell you about which power states are actually used [irrespective of the PowerCfg -a results] when you, for example, use Start button, Power, Sleep. I think I gave you the Event viewer, Custom view definition for that before -
Event viewer, Custom view, Power - Sleep-Hibernate-S0 transitions [post #40] - TenForums
This works in S0 Modern standby computers as well as in S3 Sleep computers.


All the best,
Denis

Caledon Ken said:

Think it said firmware does not support

Click to expand...

Ken, you can ignore the words used and just think of it as saying whether or not the computer is configured for ...
The words used might or might not be accurate.

Caledon Ken said:

I went through the power settings in UEFI but saw nothing preventing S3

Click to expand...

What exactly does that Bios "setting to block S3" entry say?
My Dell Bios shows explanations of each entry in the Bios page concerned [sometimes only when the entry is selected at the time]. Have you by any chance taken a photo of that page you can post?


Denis

So I checked and there is a BIOS update but it was released yesterday. I contacted Dell and they recommended I do not update. One, it won't fix issue, it was security related and two, let the brave try it first.

So I got into it with Dell and they said it was a modern processor issue, right from their chat session with engineering. The firmware does not support because the processor does not support. I said are you telling me that the new intel processors on desktop don't support S3, silence.

They suggested I kick off a task with windows scheduler prior to my tasks, which is what Denis previously suggested.

This is really BS. I mentioned the bluetooth mouse issue and again silence. I wish the whole industry would take a pause and fix what we have before given us more "Features".

Dell recommended I call MS to see why tasks are not kicking off. They no doubt will have me call the 3rd party vendors. The circle is complete.

Oh yes, engineering also said that letting a device sleep overnight, S3, is not a good idea. How many of us have been doing that for a decade at least?

Thanks Denis. I know Modern Standby is not Sleep in the old sense of the word. We've been through that. MS calls it that so I just play along.

In my power options, I have on battery and plugged in, Never Sleep. I then went in through control panel and set the same for closing the lid, on battery or plugged in, "Do Nothing". You had suggested this and things worked for about a month. One night it didn't run and that is when I used the tutorial to set the Network to be on when plugged in or on battery. Accomplished through group policy edits.

The exact message for S3 in the BIOS.

The Heading - Block Sleep.
The description - This option lets you to (sic) block entering Sleep (S3) mode in the operating system. Note: When Block Sleep is enabled, the system won't go to sleep, Intel Rapid Start will be disabled automatically, and the operating system power option will be blank if it was set to Sleep.



I will go and see if I can find event in event viewer as to its power state.

So looking through event log I see on three separate occasions, Entering Modern Standby. There are lots of other Kernel Power events that mention transition from state x to state y. X and y both being numerical values.

Interesting the Event log is flooded with Netwtw12 Event 7026 errors.

I wonder if these are related to me editing the group policies to enable network.

Thanks for getting me to look at event viewer Denis.

This is possibly a self inflict error. I looked into the driver for my network and discovered I'm running a driver that is newer than the drivers available on the Dell site. The Dell support analyst asked how did that happen. I wasn't sure but then I remembered installing the Intel support tool. Dell asked that I uninstall the driver and use theirs as they know it was tested. Did that.

Now to monitor event log and at the same time see if the tasks kick off as they were originally doing when I set system to never "Sleep" (MS's word, not mine.)

Caledon Ken said:

they said it was a modern processor issue, right from their chat session with engineering. The firmware does not support because the processor does not support. I said are you telling me that the new intel processors on desktop don't support S3, silence

Click to expand...

Somewhere in the Dell user forum or support site I saw a statement that all Dell Bioses, for computers sold after some given date, would be set for S0 Modern standby only even if the processor itself could handle S3 Sleep.
The only link I can find at the moment is to a post by a Dell user forum moderator -
I also found a Dell paper on the subject - see

In any case, my HP experience taught me that disabling S0 Modern standby & seeing PowerCfg -a results that S3 Sleep was now available did not mean that S3 Sleep now worked.

Caledon Ken said:

They suggested I kick off a task with windows scheduler prior to my tasks, which is what Denis previously suggested.

Click to expand...

Sorry, I'm not sure what you are saying here.
I suggested running some simple task just to test the Task scheduler mechanisms.
I think I posted a decent test task for you in your other thread -
Here is its key section -
The key starting operation of the test task is rousing the computer from S0 Modern standby by emulating a key press. This requires use of vbs which I run from a batch script.
- The non-existent F14 keyboard key is defined [but unused] so it can be used in SendKeys to simulate a key press without any side-effects
set ThisVBScript="%~dp0KeepDisplayOn-%RANDOM%.vbs" Echo Set WshShell = WScript.CreateObject("WScript.Shell") > %ThisVBScript% Echo WshShell.SendKeys "{F14}" >> %ThisVBScript% :RunAndReRunKeepDisplayOn Call %ThisVBScript% :: Wait a while before re-running the vbs TimeOut /T 30 GoTo RunAndReRunKeepDisplayOn
I thought I had rewritten the loop into the VBScript itself to avoid it being repeatedly called but I can't find that right now.

If a simple test task runs then it is worth checking exactly what fails within some other task that fails.
- I think you mentioned a NAS task earlier and that would only be worth analysing if a simple test task did run correctly.
- Your Bluetooth mouse might be a separate, driver-related problem.

Caledon Ken said:

engineering also said that letting a device sleep overnight, S3, is not a good idea

Click to expand...

Did they say why? I imagine that there ought to have been several ifs, buts & maybes included in such a statement.
Like you, I've been doing it for decades.
Hibernation is an option but, for all but my S0 Modern standby computers, resuming from Hibernation by means of a TS task requires AC power to be connected.
- This is not a function of the settings chosen for a given task but an absolute requirement.
- I told an MS engineer this about twenty years ago. He was astounded, put me on hold & then came back and agreed with me. This limitation was news to him, had been an accident & was not documented.
Because of this limitation, I always use S3 Sleep or S0 Modern standby overnight for the bedside computer because I do not want some AC power failure to stop me being woken up by Satchmo singing, On the sunny side of the street.

Caledon Ken said:

In my power options, I have on battery and plugged in, Never Sleep. I then went in through control panel and set the same for closing the lid, on battery or plugged in, "Do Nothing".

Click to expand...

This is what I also do.

Caledon Ken said:

One night it didn't run

Click to expand...

None of my tasks require the network so I don't have anything comparable to your problem tasks.
I have Task scheduler, Task history enabled to help me look into problems but I almost always end up having to stick Pauses and echos of variables into my scripts to find out where problems are occurring.
Echo %SomeVariable%
Pause %SomeOtherVariable%

Caledon Ken said:

The Heading - Block Sleep

Click to expand...

OK. So, rather than being an S0 Modern standby versus S3 Sleep item, it is offering you the ability to stop the computer using S3 Sleep even if it is available.
My experience of an HP computer earlier this year is that references in the Bios or the manual that imply that S3 Sleep can be managed do not necessarily mean that S3 Sleep works. I discovered that HP had merely not bothered altering the wording from some earlier version that had been designed for S3 Sleep.

Caledon Ken said:

So looking through event log I see on three separate occasions, Entering Modern Standby

Click to expand...

I assume you mean using the Event viewer, Custom view definition I gave you. I find it saves a lot of work when chasing problems.
Hold on, I thought you had disabled S0 Modern standby?
Entering S0 Modern standby should coincide with the times the display goes off.

Caledon Ken said:

the Event log is flooded with Netwtw12 Event 7026

Click to expand...

Ken, you are going to be annoyed with me for being pedantic but Event 7026 is an Event rather than an error.
I do not have Netwtw12. I have Netwtw04 on a Windows 10 computer but nothing even close in my Windows 11 one. And the Windows 10 Netwtw04 source does not show any EventIDs 7026.
I have Windows Home so perhaps it's a Pro thing? Or an AX thing? [Mine is only AC]

Caledon Ken said:

I'm running a driver that is newer than the drivers available on the Dell site ... then I remembered install the Intel support tool

Click to expand...

I appreciate that you are trying the Dell alternative now. There's no telling if it will make any difference.
I've had to move across to direct Intel updated drivers for a couple of years now on my Windows 10 laptop since Dell stopped supplying them. I have not found any problems so far.
- When I first used an Intel update for my display driver, it warned me that I was overwriting an OEM driver.
- There were no warnings for my Intel WiFi or Bluetooth driver updates.


All the best,
Denis

Thanks Denis. A huge amount to digest. I will read several more times.

So I reread, several times. Thank you for all your help.

My task that uses the NAS is Macrium Reflect using their scheduler. Can't remember why Macrium built their own scheduler but I think it was because the Windows Task Scheduler was not running Macrium correctly. There are two tasks that don't run, Macrium and SuperAntiSpyware. I don't think there can be a task more simple than start a Quick Scan is SAS. (( I am wondering if it is the Macrium Scheduler that is pushing me off the ledge as the AV is scheduled after the backup. Maybe going back to the Windows scheduler might "change" things.))

As to disabling Modern Standby, in normal operation I don't have any such setting that I'm aware of. Yes today I disabled Modern Standby with the registry edit in Shawn's tutorial but when S3 did not enable I ran the registry edit to reverse. I did not want to dig the hole deeper.

All I really know is that my tasks don't run, even though I set my device not to Sleep, again MS term. So if modern standby is enable by the screen sleeping then it will always be enabled as I'm not setting the screen to stay on permanently. In the event viewer I see it entering modern standby and I see all the kernel power events about transitioning from one number to another. Not sure where those power states are documented. Like what is power state 14?

To try your task I will have to undo 1) network changes to always be on, 2) the closing lid options and 3) never sleep to restore the machine to the S0 that it shipped with ( I think wake timers was also off ).

It is after 20:00 my time, as I type this, and Macrium ran fine which is what it will do six out of seven nights.

I would be very interested in determining why tasks don't initiate. Tomorrow, Friday, I'm going to set Macrium to use the Windows Task Scheduler. Typing this out causes one to think about things. I never considered the Macrium scheduler to be the possible cause. This is an interesting angle, thanks again for forcing me think bigger.

Caledon Ken said:

So I'm another member still struggling with Modern Standby.

I have it set to never sleep but it still manages to sleep, or nap. Backups don't run and when they do, over the network, it says it can't find the NAS. So I used the the tutorial to always enable the network in modern standby and it still occasional fails. I also had to shut off "Allow the computer to shutoff power to the bluetooth adapter" to get the mouse to run properly, it would just freeze and a reboot was required. My AV scans are also being missed.

Enough time wasted, decide to enable S3. Used this tutorial and entered the command to disable Modern Standby. Restart. Modern Standby disable but S3 not enable. Checked BIOS and the setting to block S3 is not enabled. ( This is a Dell XPS 9720 ). Dell tells me it supports S3. Before I call Dell does anyone know what I may have missed? Thanks.

Click to expand...

Here is a solution. Does anyone know if these processors support System Power State S3 (Deep Sleep)?

Caledon Ken said:

Not sure where those power states are documented.

Click to expand...

Caledon Ken said:

My task

Click to expand...

Ken,

I have now found a TS task that does not run correctly after resuming from hibernation.
It sometimes does if I start with a TimeOut /T 30 delay.
I'm going to re-test it with S3 Sleep & S0 Modern standby on different computers.
Perhaps my earlier testing did not include Hibernation?


Denis

Interesting. I did not mention in my last post but Dell asked if I was okay with shutting off hibernation and I was so I did.

I don't it on my other system but I had left it on as this was a machine that I thought would support.

I did move Macrium to the Windows scheduler and I set the AV to go 1/2 hour earlier.

If things progress on a positive path I will undo all the changes I made to never "Sleep" (MS's terminology)