Power Surge Protector Recommendation?

kelper · Dec 1, 2023

Winuser said:
I think you should read your post.

A direct strike on the cables could be a long way from your property. That is what I meant, not a strike on your home.

Winuser · Dec 1, 2023

kelper said:
A direct strike on the cables could be a long way from your property. That is what I meant, not a strike on your home.

Sorry but I took it the way you wrote it. You specified local and to me that would be somewhere close.

kelper · Dec 1, 2023

I've never heard of anyone in UK suffering any damage from lightning at home, so I suspect it's very rare. As we all have good backups now perhaps surge protectors are less needed? We can replace a computer and restore from a backup, so won't lose any data. I don't keep my backup USB HDD connected when not using Macrium Reflect. Perhaps I should alternate between two external drives. Another factor is my using a laptop. I think its PSU might get fried without damaging the laptop.

newmann · Dec 1, 2023

So the situation is like this. When I'm outside the US... where I am at the majority of the year, where I'm located... the electrical wiring is not good like the US at least I don't think. I am not sure if it is grounded or not. Even if I move to another apartment, same thing, doesn't matter.

But I basically connect a UPS to a wall outlet... then connect my laptop, monitors etc to the UPS and have no issue with it. The issue though is my UPS has that Wiring Fault that is bright red though. It's been like that for a long time and some people mention it has to do with it not being grounded or some wiring issue and things like that? However, my UPS battery went dead a while back and I never replaced it. I bought this UPS maybe 4 to 5 years ago or so. I believe the UPS battery went dead 3 years ago or so. So back then I never used my UPS much at all except when connecting it to my laptop when power outage. So even though the UPS was plugged into a wall outlet, I rarely powered it on because I didn't connect anything to it back then.

What I did for years was connect my laptop, monitors and everything to a surge protector that connects to the wall outlet. I believe that surge protector had 600 joules or so. Well one night when my laptop and monitors and everything was connected... there was rain and then a loud thunder. I remember when this happened, I was laying on the bed without my glasses and pretty sure I saw some electricity zap from my old xps 9550 laptop. I then went and took a look and notice my internet went off. I then took a look and one of my 2 monitors didn't power on. I unplugged the hdmi to hdmi cable that was connected to that monitor and plug it back in and it didn't work and apparently that thunder fried the hdmi port on the xps 9550. I then took a look at my cable ethernet adapter for wired internet that I connected my laptop to and it looked bent. I then unplugged it and then just connected via wifi. The next day or maybe later, I took a look at the cable matters ethernet adapter and not only noticed it was bent ... there was a frying smell as well. So basically the thunder zapped my hdmi port on the xps 9550 laptop and also the cable matters ethernet adapter so I threw that ethernet adapter away. That xps 9550 laptop still works without issue... but the hdmi port doesn't work. I ended up getting a new xps 9520 laptop though but the reason for that was because I needed a faster laptop.

So now when I'm there, I connect my laptop, monitors etc to the UPS that has a dead battery and had no issues so far. But again it has that wiring fault that is bright red. Back years ago, ,I don't recall it was ever like that. Is it possible it's bright read because it's the dead battery or not? Now is it possible my cables are loose in the UPS? I do keep the UPS on the floor so I do move it around when I kick it somethings so would I have to check if all the cables are secure and maybe that's why? But still safe to continue using the UPS without a replacement battery right? I know I have to buy 2 ups batteries for it because it is a Cyberpower 1500VA UPS though so I never bothered and just used it as a power strip/surge protector. But does it give any surge protection?

I still however use that same surge protector where I had that power surge for my internet modem/router and a wireless camera though. Would you say it's a bad idea and just toss it out? I didn't want to because I needed a few outlets and I used up all in the UPS. And because if something happens to the internet modem/router or the wireless camera, it isn't a big deal. But I certainly wasn't going to connect my newer xps 9520 laptop or my old monitors to it. But is using that same surge protector still safe or not?

newmann · Dec 1, 2023

Now where I'm at now in the US, I'm on here a short time only. So the place I stay at, I don't believe they ever had a power outage ever even when there is thunderstorms etc. They use an old power strip that has 6 slots and it has worked for them for years. This power strip is minimum 5 years but it works for them and because they only connect their phones to it. So no tv, laptop or anything like that so there is always enough space. But when I'm here, I would connect a laptop and monitor sometimes and phone etc. My concern is if I connect this many devices to this power strip which isn't even a surge protector, is there a risk to my laptop and the monitor? The monitor is one that I have here in the US so I use it when I'm here as I don't have my 32' 4k monitor here with me in the US.

So far, there hasn't been any issue connecting even 2 laptops and a phone to that 6 outlet power strip. But should I buy a belkin surge protector at least to use when I'm here or this shouldn't be a concern? Now if I were to connect say a laptop and 2 monitors... then I should? I only have 1 monitor here in the US and it's an old 20' 1920x1200 monitor so no where as big as a 32' 4k.

The concern here is reading reviews on surge protectors and how some people say the belkin one they had blew out. One other person said they smelled fire and had they not notice it before they left the house, that would have been bad. I know it's a few negative reviews but when there is over 30,000 reviews for an electronic product, obviously there will still be at least 1000 negative reviews at the minimum... even for a great product. But since this basic 6 outlet power strip has worked for them here, I guess don't buy a surge protector? What about buying a surge protector but only using it when I'm here and connecting my devices to it but once I leave, just unplug the surge protector or just take it with me? Or don't bother with a surge protector here?

TraderGary · Dec 1, 2023

Why not just replace the battery on your old UPS? If you are hesitant about doing it yourself, when you are back in the USA, just take it to a BestBuy and the BestBuy Geek Squad will sell you a new battery, do the replacement for you and check it all out.

newmann · Dec 1, 2023

TraderGary said:
Why not just replace the battery on your old UPS? If you are hesitant about doing it yourself, when you are back in the USA, just take it to a BestBuy and the BestBuy Geek Squad will sell you a new battery, do the replacement for you and check it all out.

The reason was because someone said if you connect your xps laptop to the UPS when power outage, you not going to even get more than 1 hour battery backup. The only reason I bought a UPS back then was because I thought it would give me at least 2 hours of backup in case I get a power outage. I thought it might even give 3 hours or more.

I had tested the UPS when connecting to my old xps laptop previously to test it, but I don't recall how long battery backup I got. I think it did get me at least 1 hour or so but it couldn't have been more than 1 hour 30 minutes with the 1500 VA UPS. Does that sound right? Well I rarely used the UPS for the first few years. I just had it plugged into a wall outlet and rarely powered it on. I just connected my laptop, monitors etc to a 600 joule surge protector and only used the UPS when power outage. But after a thunder strike, the hdmi port on my laptop went bad also also broke my cable ethernet adapter with it. I then continued to use the old xps 9550 but then bought a new xps 9520 laptop, Reason was because I wanted a faster laptop.

There isn't any issue with using the xps 9550 except hdmi port doesn't work but I don't use that laptop anymore. So I then used the Cyberpower 1500 VA as my power strip/surge protector as oppose to the 600 joule surge protector I used because I'm not sure what damage it incurred during the thunder. So the newer xps 9520 laptop and monitors etc are connected to the Cyberpower 1500 VA. The issue is the UPS battery is dead and I didn't replace it. I was going to buy a new battery but then I read you actually need to buy 2 batteries for it because it's 1500 VA. So instead of having to spend say over $65 for it, I had to spend double that so $130 and didn't want to bother with it. But not only that... I am pretty sure I won't install it correctly so probably have to go to a computer shop for them to install it which probably cost me total everything at least $150 total so I didn't bother with hit. The UPS I have is in the other country where I'm at most of the year. I don't have this UPS in the US. I would have to buy the battery replacement in another country..

garioch7 · Dec 1, 2023

He doesn't stop.

32' 4K Curved Monitor Opinions?

I respectfully suggest that no one in this Forum, or in any of the others in which he has posted this identical topic, will ever satisfy him.

From what I have observed, here and on other Forums, is that he craves attention, not solutions. I think that you are wasting your time and talents.

On that note, I am out of here.

Have a great day.

Regards,
Phil

Winuser · Dec 1, 2023

kelper said:
I've never heard of anyone in UK suffering any damage from lightning at home, so I suspect it's very rare.

I have lost electronic devices from power surges but never from a lightning strike.

Winuser · Dec 1, 2023

newmann said:
So now when I'm there, I connect my laptop, monitors etc to the UPS that has a dead battery and had no issues so far. But again it has that wiring fault that is bright red. Back years ago, ,I don't recall it was ever like that. Is it possible it's bright read because it's the dead battery or not? Now is it possible my cables are loose in the UPS? I do keep the UPS on the floor so I do move it around when I kick it somethings so would I have to check if all the cables are secure and maybe that's why? But still safe to continue using the UPS without a replacement battery right? I know I have to buy 2 ups batteries for it because it is a Cyberpower 1500VA UPS though so I never bothered and just used it as a power strip/surge protector. But does it give any surge protection?

My guess is that you have an expensive power strip that just supplies power to your devices. No battery backup and I doubt the surge protector is doing anything. You can look up the online manual for the UPS. That will tell you what the red light is telling you.

newmann · Dec 2, 2023

Winuser said:
I have lost electronic devices from power surges but never from a lightning strike.

What I had described with my older xps 15 9550 with the hdmi port not working and the ethernet adapter bent and a smell and thus fried is from a lightning strike correct? There was lot of lightning and then a thunder zap and when this happened, I didn't have my glasses on but was laying down on the bed but I definitely saw some electricity zap from either the hdmi port or the 600 joule surge protector. I couldn't tell if there was any electricity zapping t the other side of the laptop where I had the ethernet adapter side but when I went there, both the hdmi port didn't work and my ethernet cable didn't work. When that thunder strike I happened, I had my doors and windows closed but there was definitely sparks of electricity that showed. That was a lightning strike right? But that laptop still worked fine after that. That 600 joule surge protector still seems to have issue. I only connect the internet/modem and a security camera to the 600 joule surge protector though. Not going to connect the newer xps 15 9520 laptop or any laptop to it. Is there much risk connecting things to it? I did connect my older xps 15 9550 laptop to it for a short while after that though but then just connected it to my cyberpower 1500va UPS that had a dead battery so using it like a power strip.

newmann · Dec 2, 2023

Winuser said:
My guess is that you have an expensive power strip that just supplies power to your devices. No battery backup and I doubt the surge protector is doing anything. You can look up the online manual for the UPS. That will tell you what the red light is telling you.

I recalled I looked it up and it said something about the wiring fault and ground. I am wondering if that red light showed up a bit after the thunder? The thing is before that, I don't recall it being that red but it might have been already since the UPS battery was dead. But I have no issues still using it as a power strip.

Winuser · Dec 3, 2023

newmann said:
What I had described with my older xps 15 9550 with the hdmi port not working and the ethernet adapter bent and a smell and thus fried is from a lightning strike correct?

I do believe that you're correct about the damage being from a lightning strike and not just a normal power surge.

newmann said:
I recalled I looked it up and it said something about the wiring fault and ground. I am wondering if that red light showed up a bit after the thunder? The thing is before that, I don't recall it being that red but it might have been already since the UPS battery was dead. But I have no issues still using it as a power strip.

The red light is definitely a warning that the UPS is not working correctly. Just remember that your devices are not being protected by the malfunctioning UPS. When the battery died in my UPS as I recall the light was green until I plugged something into a outlet that was on the battery backup side. I do remember that the light flashed red then kicked out the circuit breaker. I think this subject and a couple of other threads you started have been discussed enough and nothing new can be added to them. I'll reply to new threads you post if I think you're being serious because I do want to help others when I can.

newmann · Dec 3, 2023

So the lightning strike hit what exactly to cause my hdmi port to not work and the cable ethernet adapter to not work and fry and smell? Does that mean my neighbor wasn't affected by it? When this occurred, I don't think the apartment next to me had someone there so I didn't ask.

But the thunder hits one apartment but not another? Or it would hit a number of apartments in the same building?

I'm not even sure when the battery was no longer working in the UPS. I do know I notice it much later though so it could even been for few months. Again at the time I didn't even use the surge protector unless I needed to connect to it during a power outage. Then one day I remember I powered it on and connected my laptop to it just to test it out and the minutes went from 200 minutes to 0 minutes in like 2 minutes which meant battery went bad. I don't think I notice any green light but if there was, it was a while back when the battery went bad. The thing is with this UPS, would you suggest buying 2 new batteries if I want to use it again or try to check if there are any loose connections or bring it to a computer repair shop just to check if it still works or not? Obviously I don't want to buy 2 new batteries and then it still has issues. The main issue is that red light in the wiring fault that is bright red. I am pretty certain when the UPS worked with a good battery, it wasn't that red.

Dru2 · Dec 3, 2023

Talk about turning a simple subject/solution into rocket science

Nothing on planet earth is going to account for every infinite "what-if" in the universe. That just leads to paralysis through analysis. And yes, no unit will guarantee total protection against all forces of nature.

Not sure you can get a UPS "home unit" with more than two hours of battery time (called Runtime). Most will be about an 1 to 1.5 hours for loads less than 90 watts. A device with say a load of 90 or less watts will see a little over an hour of battery backup (per APC's estimates depending on units). However, the more active devices connected, the greater the load, the less the battery backup (Runtime).

Also, the greater the Runtime, the costlier the unit. These times will be listed in the specs of the unit sort. You can go to say Product Comparator | APC, compare units and get an estimate of what their run time will be. Here I compared 3 units at a minimum of $200 dollars (APC's site price), with a minimum load of 90 watts...

With all the stuff connected to my Cyberpower CP1500PFCLCD UPS, I get an average of 15 minutes run time. More than enough time for me to close out what I'm doing and shutdown. If I need more emergency power, I might look to a backup power generator

newmann · Dec 4, 2023

Yes I know the more VA you get for a UPS, the longer runtime it will last. So when I bought they cyberpower ups years ago, I bought the 1500VA/900W one.

You say it would get between 1 to 1.5 hours if plugging in 90W or less. The thing is if I were to connect only my laptop to it, the xps 15 9520, how long would it get on average? The thing is I don't know how much watts the laptop draws. The dell laptop charger is 130w but I have used a Dell PW7018LC powerbank which only does 65w and it works to charge it but slow charging. Is the only way to know how much watts the xps laptop draws is but a meter? Or is there a program to check how much watts it draws? Also the watts it draws changes every second right depending on what you do? So if you using the nvidia 3050, it will use more than when using just the intel iris xe graphics?

The thing is say you are using the xps laptop for over an hour and literally doing the same thing. Whether it's web browsing few tabs or youtubing a video over and over or doing something more excessive on it. Assuming you doing something the same, the watt it draws every second will be very close right? Is there a way to estimate how much it draws when just youtubing? Also does the watt it draw changes whether you are using it plugged in via laptop charger, compared to on laptop battery compared to a powerbank connected to it?

TM21 · Dec 4, 2023

From all the yada, yada, yada, I know this will be over the head of many of the readers on this forum.
But, I've been an electronics tech for 40+ years, so I do a lot of things, "out of the box", not in the book, etc.

Instead of spending way too much money on a high wattage UPS, just to get a longer run time, I buy the one brand UPS that I know will work with MUCH bigger batteries, of the car or truck type.

I have four UPS's, and two of them still have the OEM batteries, and two are now connected to larger batteries that would fit in a Tractor.

This is an APC 450VA UPS, where the OEM battery has been replaced with a Tractor Battery. Run time is in excess of five hours, powering a Desktop PC, and a 24" Monitor.

These two batteries power an APC brand, 600VA UPS, and the run time is in excess of 8 hours.
Either of these two batteries will start my car, if I ever need one in an emergency.

All the batteries that I use, I got from Walmart for $29 ea. They are all of the FULL Maintenance type.
Since they remain on Charge 24x7, they need to be checked every few months, to maintain the proper fluid level.
The acid never goes away, but the water in the battery will boil off in time, so that needs to be replaced, with Distilled Water.

I used to run a Battery Test lab at the Caterpillar Research Center, so I know more about batteries and their care, than I really want to. lol

Cheers Mates, and Merry Christmas!
TM

MisterEd · Dec 4, 2023

I have an APC Back-UPS Pro (BX850M). I wish I had gotten the 1500VA version. However, Powerchute estimates about 28 minutes of battery power. I don't know how accurate that is. In any case they recommend you only stay on the battery for maybe 5 minutes before you shut down. You can stay on it for the maximum time until it shuts down your computer but then it would probably take more than 8 hours to recharge the battery. I like to run the self-test in Powerchute to make sure it is running OK. It is supposed to always run a self-test at power-up but I don't power it off and back on very often.

I also have the APC BE600M1 and BE425M UPSs. Like the APC BX850M, the APC BE600M1 has a battery compartment door to make battery replacement easy for the user. Unfortunately, the APC BE425M does not have this door. However, a skilled user should be able to remove the case and replace the battery.

TraderGary · Dec 4, 2023

I have an APC UPS and the only devices attached to it are my cable modem and my router. My two computers are described in "My Computers" below. They can easily stay up for all day on their own battery power and, depending on whether the cell tower is out, I've easily stayed on the Internet and outlasted any power outage in the last several years.

kelper · Dec 5, 2023

TraderGary said:
I have an APC UPS and the only devices attached to it are my cable modem and my router. My two computers are described in "My Computers" below. They can easily stay up for all day on their own battery power and, depending on whether the cell tower is out, I've easily stayed on the Internet and outlasted any power outage in the last several years.

But you are unusual in this forum in not using a desktop computer.

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