Windows 12 ! Already....

johnlgalt · Jun 23, 2023

Windows One FTW.

Or, even better - Windows Eternal :ROFLMAO:

WAI · Jun 23, 2023

WiN12 is just going to be like 11...

James · Jun 23, 2023

zebal said:
MS will make it worse in fact, win32 desktop programs will be containerized to run as store apps.
In other words Windows is going to become one huge pile of virtual environment.

At that point it is either Linux or just buy a MacBook for me, not going to lie.

James · Jun 23, 2023

WAI said:
WiN12 is just going to be like 11...

Yep. But worse.

spapakons · Jun 23, 2023

That's what the customization software is for. As we can make Windows 10/11 look like XP or 7 or 8.1, so we will make Windows 12 too. I even replace most of the system icons to look like 7 or 8.1, see relevant threads.

James · Jun 23, 2023

spapakons said:
That's what the customization software is for. As we can make Windows 10/11 look like XP or 7 or 8.1, so we will make Windows 12 too. I even replace most of the system icons to look like 7 or 8.1, see relevant threads.

I use Explorerpatcher on windows 11 to use the win 10 taskbar and start menu.
It’s strange, on windows 7 people wanted windows xp styling, on windows 8/10 people wanted windows 7 styling, and windows 11 people want windows 10 styling. Windows 12 people will want windows 11 styling. I mean - on windows 10 I hated the styling.. but then I upgrade to 11

spapakons · Jun 23, 2023

When XP was out, many preferred Windows 98. When 7 was out, many preferred Windows XP, etc etc etc. History repeats itself.

James · Jun 23, 2023

spapakons said:
When XP was out, many preferred Windows 98. When 7 was out, many preferred Windows XP, etc etc etc. History repeats itself.

I am exactly like this. In windows 12 I would like to see aero, and the 3d features of windows 7. Maybe that’s just me, liking old ui.

zebal · Jun 23, 2023

Is it true that ISS (intl. space station) runs windows 98 on an old pentium CPU?
I heard it's true for CPU due to stability so I guess they also run XP or even win 98.

spapakons · Jun 24, 2023

Most probably, if nobody took the time to upgrade the computer or the OS. As I say, I prefer installing Windows 98 or XP on old hardware than Linux. I might miss compatibility with some new features but I will have great compatibility with old applications and games and this is much more important for me. I value compatibility more than having a modern OS.

Bree · Jun 24, 2023

zebal said:
the 3rd decimal number stands for "patch"
Major (dot) Minor (dot) Patch (dot) Revision

Actually for MS the third number is 'build'......

zebal · Jun 24, 2023

Bree said:
Actually for MS the third number is 'build'......

Yeah, you're right but it's interesting isn't?
I don't know why windows stuck on v10.0 and why only build number is incremented?

cereberus · Jun 24, 2023

zebal said:
Yeah, you're right but it's interesting isn't?
I don't know why windows stuck on v10.0 and why only build number is incremented?

The 10.0 refers to the main kernel of the OS and that has not changed.

zebal · Jun 24, 2023

cereberus said:
The 10.0 refers to the main kernel of the OS and that has not changed.

Are you sure about that?

Operating System Version - Win32 apps

The Version API Helper functions are used to determine the version of the operating system that is currently running. For more information, see Getting the System Version.

learn.microsoft.com

spapakons · Jun 24, 2023

The kernel is the core of the OS, that means that Windows 10 and 11 are similar with slightly different interface, since they share the same kernel.

zebal · Jun 24, 2023

I've been searching around net and there seem to be indications that MS in previous windows versions ~~versioned~~ named the OS according to kernel but it's no longer a case:

What is the kernel version of Windows .NET Server and Windows XP?

www.itprotoday.com

All the current docs indicate this now just windows version.

Even kernel file matches OS version:

edit:
Seems like cerberus is correct:

Comparison of Microsoft Windows versions - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Scannerman · Jun 24, 2023

I don't recall the precise terminology, but I do recall the public statement to the effect that there would not be any more new Windows operating systems released after Windows 10, that all subsequent releases would merely be upgrades. Well, we all know they kinda sorta waffled on that, but so far they kinda sorta stuck with that plan based on the kernel. Despite the kernel not changing they certainly tossed a number of hurdles in front of old school users like myself. I'm not so convinced that these changes fit the definition of progress let alone security.

TPM2 has already consistently proven itself unreliable, yet it is a mandatory requirement for Win 11, rendering every PC that doesn't provide this specific hardware obsolete. So much for these "green" Corporations. The resulting e waste will be exponential. In the name of the Consortium Intel dropped support for Optane. Microsoft no longer supports Intel Turbo Boost Technology in Win 11 because Intel dropped the ball. What a mess!

Myself, I am grateful for the brilliant minds in this forum who have helped me with my computer challenges more times than I am able to mention. That said I don't think I'll be of much help to others what with all these new fangled changes, and, frankly, I don't think they are even changes for the better. Linux pretty much provides for all my computing needs now and at least there's no mandatory TPM requirement with Linux. Alas, I have four females here, on the home front, who all like the new stuff and I'm the grunt/janitor that is expected to keep their devices and the network up and running. Meanwhile I have a basement full of old and obsolete hardware that still functions. It is enough to keep me busy.

It would seem that my days as an enthusiast are over. I'm stepping aside for AGI and all the other crap Microsoft is making room for. Admittedly, I am curious to see where all this goes, but life is short and I'm living on borrowed time. I confess that reading the posts in the Forums (7,8,10,11) is informative and entertaining. If I live to see Windows 12 manifest in my lifetime I'll be treating it like a novelty. I can't afford to take any of this stuff seriously anymore. IMO Windows is a disaster. All of us are entitled to our opinions, yes?

TM21 · Jun 24, 2023

What difference does it make, when I'm sitting in a bar and having a burger and a beer? The latest OS is the furthest thing from my mind!

All these numbers, and such, are so superficial. Who really gives a rat's #$$?
Why even think about upgrading to Windows 12, if your current OS is working for you?
All my 64 bit capable PC's are running SWEET on Win-11/Pro/64, * so why would I ever want to change?
* And NO TPM in sight! Rufus took care of all that BS for me, and millions of other happy Windows users.
My PC's are all so old that they barely run on transistors, instead of vacuum tubes.
And my 32 bit PC's, mostly laptops, are running Win-8.1/Pro/x86, very happily! That will never change.
They will go right from Windows 8.1 to reclamation.

All this talk about "OH, I'll have to buy a new computer" is pure insanity!
Wise up mates!

johnlgalt · Jun 24, 2023

Scannerman said:
The resulting e waste will be exponential.

I disagree with the whole "This will cause eWaste".

For one thing, older PCs are routinely refurbished and used in a variety of places, and for the second thing, the increase in eWaste is due to humans deciding to upgrade more often, and having more devices, than they used to.

30 years ago, pagers were prevalent, cell phones almost non existent, and majority of people didn't have a desktop and a laptop.

Today?

I have a desktop I built, a Laptop I bought, 2 cell phones, a tablet, 4 desktop monitors, a TV downstairs and another upstairs, a smart watch, 3 sets of wireless IEMs plus 1 OTE set, 2 capture cards, a controller, and much much more. And that is just me. Now analyze how many devices a family of four collectively owns.

30 years ago, I was 22, and I had exactly 1 laptop and one pager.

Pretend all you want, but we are buying more devices, and that is how we are getting more waste - not because of irreconcilable differences of a new OS that won't work on older hardware.That is pure rubbish.

TechnoMage2021 said:
What difference does it make, when I'm sitting in a bar and having a burger and a beer? The latest OS is the furthest thing from my mind!

Good for you.

Windows 10 works better than Windows 11 in some aspects. In spite of that I'm running 11. Whatever comes out next is what I will probably be running when it comes out.

Just because you don't care doesn't mean the rest of us don't.

Scannerman · Jun 24, 2023

TechnoMage2021 said:
What difference does it make, when I'm sitting in a bar and having a burger and a beer? The latest OS is the furthest thing from my mind!

All these numbers, and such, are so superficial. Who really gives a rat's #$$?
Why even think about upgrading to Windows 12, if your current OS is working for you?
All my 64 bit capable PC's are running SWEET on Win-11/Pro/64, so why would I ever want to change?
And my 32 bit PC's, mostly laptops, are running Win-8.1/Pro/x86, very happily! That will never change.

All this talk about "OH, I'll have to buy a new computer" is pure insanity!

There was an appeal to enthusiasts that made sense to me for over a decade but I'm having a hard time justifying it now. Win 10 is good for support for at least another 5 years and I'm still using Win 7 U without issue. So, I share your sentiments my friend. I stopped being impressed with Windows after Windows 8. The "convenience" came at a serious cost for me, as it did for most tower power users. 8.1 was an improvement, I must admit, but not nearly enough to convince me that it was better than Win 7 U (despite the easy sleazy driver thing). 10 was a huge disappointment for me and I was really hoping 11 would give us a real OS instead of a variation on a theme. At least they ditched Cortana.

But you are so right. My old 32 bit mini tower is still running like a finely oiled piece of machinery despite being capped out @ 4GB of RAM. If I need more than this I always have my 82 lb beast (featured in the profile pic). I doubt that I'll ever need more than 128GB for my uses. I'm at the level of a domestic end user. I'm not number crunching for CERN or operating a main frame. I'm not even an IT.

Alas, I'm not off the hook. The sort of things my daughters do on PCs requires newer hardware so I still have to stay abreast of the old tech. In this regard I'm grateful for these forums

Windows 12 ! Already....

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